Make the demo require a registered username. [Archive]

Cue-Ball

29th August 2005, 17:21

It seems that wreckers are a big problem on demo servers. Unfortunately, the demo servers are all that people have access to before buying the whole game. Since demo drivers don't have a registered name, there's no way to ban wreckers from demo servers. Perhaps the next version of the demo could require a similar registration as the full game so that demo servers can maintain ban lists and have something remotely resembling clean, fun racing.

mrodgers

29th August 2005, 17:31

Excellent idea, I just posted in one of the "wrecker" threads in the main section the same thing. Note, I didn't steal your idea here and post it elsewhere LOL. I posted it about 10 minutes ago, then made it through the forum to this post, LOL.

bobvanvliet

29th August 2005, 17:33

Huru-aito

29th August 2005, 17:35

And what would stop the wreckers not to register again when their first username would be banned on most of the servers? Good idea but needs something more :thumb:

budabudabass

29th August 2005, 17:51

I don't know if this is possible. But you could make it so each download has a demo username locked to it which you can't change. That way in order to get a new demo ID you'd have to download the program again. This would surely discourage people because they'd have to download a fairly big file every time.

the_angry_angel

29th August 2005, 18:20

The problem would be how to record this information in the executable in such a way that its not hex-editable, and also in such a way that its all automated. I'm pretty sure Scawen doesnt want to have to manually compile, or provide information to compile a new executable per user, not only for each download, but also patches, etc.

Again, a nice idea, but impractical given LFS' business model.

Cue-Ball

29th August 2005, 22:05

And what would stop the wreckers not to register again when their first username would be banned on most of the servers? Good idea but needs something more :thumb:

Well, you can't just change your name using a registered copy of S2 and magically be removed from ban lists. If the demo had a similar registration then it could work. Of course it's hard to speculate without knowing all the details of the code like Scawen does, but surely something can be done. When there are as many posts about wreckers as there are, and when a major gaming mag says the worst thing about a game is the people playing it, it's a problem that needs to be addressed.

Gunn

29th August 2005, 22:53

Maybe if the demo wasn't multiplayer...... :x

Woz

30th August 2005, 01:37

If the demo user account is locked to an email address it might work. Yes its easy to get free email addy's but if you have to go through the loop od getting a new email addy, registering LFS etc every time you are banned it might start to have an effect.

Also it will be possible to build up a central ban list then managed by the master server

strato12345

30th August 2005, 14:36

If the demo user account is locked to an email address it might work. Yes its easy to get free email addy's but if you have to go through the loop od getting a new email addy, registering LFS etc every time you are banned it might start to have an effect.

that plus that u should have to wait 24hours before ur account would be activated.. :)

Bruce314

30th August 2005, 14:41

Maybe if the demo wasn't multiplayer...... :x

This idea is not so bad BUT :
- you loose one of the great interest of the game (ok, wrecking is also annoying)
- until now, an AI car can't be much more reliable than a usual wrecker... Offline playing hides the truth : LFS is designed firstly as a multiplayer game for mature people...

bobvanvliet

30th August 2005, 14:41

that plus that u should have to wait 24hours before ur account would be activated.. :)

Getting rid of unwanteds is all fine and dandy, but we shouldn't throw up too much of a barrier for people who want to just take a quick peek at the game (and become totally addicted in 2 minutes... ;) ).

I think 24h waiting does just that. Having to register your demo with e-mail validation is barrier enough imho.

And no matter how hard you make it, there will always be ***** pieces of *** that go to enormous lengths to tick people off, we're never going to be able to stop that with any reasonable measure I think.

AndroidXP

30th August 2005, 14:42

u should have to wait 24hours before ur account would be activatedHaha, yeah of course :rolleyes:

---
"Hey look dude, I found a demo of something claiming to be a true racing sim! Just what we've been looking for forever."

"Great! Let's try it out"

"OK.. hmm have to register, well ok, this game looks promising, so here we go"

*waits*

"WTH, 24h till my account is activated?!"

*deletes demo*
---

Great marketing strategy!

strato12345

30th August 2005, 16:04

... and singleplayer woud be availabe rite away..

faster111

13th February 2006, 18:46

Maybe if the demo wasn't multiplayer...... :x

thats a bad idea

wheel4hummer

13th February 2006, 20:18

Gunn

13th February 2006, 23:24

thats a bad ideaNot buying a license is a bad idea.

FPVaaron

14th February 2006, 05:43

I don't like the idea of having demo users have to be registed some just want to download and play and that's the fun of demo servers the amount of wreckers. I love some times going into a demo server and avoiding all the wreckers as a challange. If you don't like demo wreckers it's simple, just don't play demo.

IDUI

10th May 2006, 20:05

I think this would be a good idea.

There is however, also something to be said for simple, immediate and unregistered access to online play... Maybe a Demo registration could be an option and servers could be set up to allow all people or just registered ones.
Don't think anyone commented on this(got sidetracked). Sounds like a good idea, if possible. The servers with registered users only would have an easier time keeping the lapper clean. No need for 24 hour stuff. Just registering requires an email-- getting new mail addresses may be pain enough. Right?

BlakjeKaas

10th May 2006, 20:08

AndroidXP

10th May 2006, 20:33

They can reconnect under a different IP mere seconds later. Banning is practically useless on demo servers, especially against dedicated wreckers.

NotAnIllusion

10th May 2006, 21:15

Also, the maximum ban period is 4 weeks I think, even if a higher value is entered. SP demo would suck, LFS being an online racing sim. I would never have bough LFS without being able to try the MP first, and doubt this would have changed had the AI been decent.

Registering for a demo account would be tolerable, although I have deleted several demos that required registration for this very reason. IMO it is very difficult to force ppl who want to try a free demo to register or go through other hoops. The best thing about the demo was being able to Just Race(tm), I'd like to see this not changed.

filur

10th May 2006, 21:25

LFS (demo) could supply the master server with one of these hardware-based keys, if the key doesn't exist an 'account' is created needing no user input, the player gets assigned a username tied to this 'account' (guest19538 etc.), which server admins can properly ban.

NotAnIllusion

10th May 2006, 21:39

Instead of tying it to an account, would it work if, when connecting, LFS just sent the HWID to the server, in which case the username and IP of the connectee would be irrelevant and the ban would register the ID in bans.ban?

*Oh yeah, and what happens when more than one person plays LFS on the same PC, but only one is an intentional wrecker? For example if the kid brother's a bit of a tosser but the big bro is quite clean a driver.

filur

10th May 2006, 21:49

JohnUK89

10th May 2006, 22:48

*Oh yeah, and what happens when more than one person plays LFS on the same PC, but only one is an intentional wrecker? For example if the kid brother's a bit of a tosser but the big bro is quite clean a driver.

Big bro unzips LFS to a different location and leaves that locked, passwords his PC, and prevents bro using the unlocked LFS using security options built into the NTFS file system :)

XCNuse

10th May 2006, 22:55

thats why theres a great thing known as user names on computers lol ;)

and someone had a fantastic idea of having the ability to put passwords on them so no one can mess with your stuff
brilliant idea isnt it lol

+1 for idea, but its too impractical

just need to make a blacklist lol

Viper93

10th May 2006, 23:00

I say leave the demo the way it is, if you don't like wreckers buy a license. :shrug::thumbsdow:twocents:

XCNuse

10th May 2006, 23:01

easier said than done in some countries though viper

Hankstar

10th May 2006, 23:06

How about a time-limited demo? Give people 100 hours (for example) of online play, then when it runs out it asks if you want to buy a license..if not, no online left but you can still race the AI..

I, like many of us, had plenty of experiences with S2 demo wreckers back in the day and I would've killed for a ban system that actually worked. It's no problem for me anymore but just the idea of dedicated wreckers and "wrecker teams" pisses me off. I just can't think of a bigger waste of time than firing up your PC, getting on to a server and making enemies (not to mention it's totally anonymous and actually quite cowardly - I mean, if you went into a bar and messed up someone's game of 8-ball you'd get a cue to the head quicker than you could say "WTF").

How about this: if someone gets banned from more than one server in a day they're blocked from the main server and can't even see a server list or start their own? Is that even feasible?

Viper93

10th May 2006, 23:08

Your probably right, I do not know. Just think of how many more names would have to be stored to do that =)

XCNuse

10th May 2006, 23:10

hell ..i say we just make up our own cracks that lock up LFS entirely for all the people that do crack LFS and then.. ..well, sit back, have some lemonade and laugh

Stellios

10th May 2006, 23:11

Time limited demo i would agree with, if you dont want it after say 50 days then your not going to want it at all.

Viper93

10th May 2006, 23:18

Time limited demo i would agree with, if you dont want it after say 50 days then your not going to want it at all.

I like the idea but then the new people that get the demo will not nearly as big of fields when they play the demo, that "could" effect on how they view the game. You could say the same for the banning thing, both ways.

NotAnIllusion

11th May 2006, 00:41

Big bro unzips LFS to a different location and leaves that locked, passwords his PC, and prevents bro using the unlocked LFS using security options built into the NTFS file system :)
Ah but if, as suggested, the ID is based on the HW, wouldn't it be the same for both copies? If yes, it sounds a bit ineffective; If not, what stops a wrecker having multiple copies of LFS and just switching between them?

Time limited demo i would agree with, if you dont want it after say 50 days then your not going to want it at all.
Problem with time-limited software is that, unlike online unlocking, it's relatively easy to crack. Just have a look at the amount of time-limited software, and the % of which have a way of going around it. Although if it could be made secure it could be an option.

Wordan

11th May 2006, 09:12

Im sure something like banning demo racers using a hardware based key would be workable. Of course someone is always going to find a way around it no matter how hard you try, but it will take more effort and cut down on the number of wreckers

the_angry_angel

11th May 2006, 10:14

Ooh, now thats an interesting idea...

duke_toaster

11th May 2006, 15:44

Demo racers should NOT be allowed to post in improvement suggestions.

Also, the demo should require e-mail activation and also an unlock thing (one unlock of the demo content). Also, a 14 day time limit on the demo.

bal00

11th May 2006, 16:38

LFS should just take some hints from IRC and let server admins ban hostmasks instead of single IP's. Hell, it would be enough to have access to the users IP's through InSim and people could easily write their own ban tools, but the way it is now, there's nothing you can do against wreckers getting a new IP and coming back with a different nick.

It would also be great for admins to have a /whois command to display a users host, so you can easily tell if the user who just joined is the same guy you banned 20 secs ago.

This whole issue would be so easy to resolve, but instead we're forced to spend half an hour banning the same guy over and over or even making the whole server private just because of one guy.

Oh...another things that really bugs me about the demo hosts is that admins do not have an option to limit the number of clients per IP. You have wreckers clearing whole servers via vote banning cause they have 6 clients connected at the same time. Seen it first hand...

werewolf

12th May 2006, 11:07

Maybe we should look at some other options to get rid of the wreckers.

One thing I tought of at work today:
Including the drag strip in the demo. Maybe just the 4 lane , not the 8 lane.
Don't flame just yet , let me explain first

When I was still playing on the demo server , I noticed a lot of demo drivers were using the straight on Blackwood as a drag strip. They set up at the run-off area , 4 cars next to eachother and drag race. Usually they crash into any car that is actually racing laps on that server.
If the demo included the drag strip , drag race wannabees can race there , and leave the others alone on the track.

Plus , putting the drag strip in may convince some of the demo racers to buy the game. Once they notice they can drive a 490hp car on a 8 lane drag strip , they could get interested.

Just my 2 eurocents. What do you think ? (you can start flaming now)

Bob Smith

12th May 2006, 11:45

How about a time-limited demo? Give people 100 hours (for example) of online play, then when it runs out it asks if you want to buy a license..if not, no online left but you can still race the AI..
Not a bad idea. I don't like time limited demos but if the limit is that high and only applies to online, anyone who hits the limit must be hooked and should spend the cash.

Hankstar

12th May 2006, 12:25

Well, people need a fair trial and 100 hours could provide as much as a couple of months usage, depending on the level of addiction. Then, when they're totally hooked, make them buy it or take away their online play forever! Ar-harr! :xpirate:

Until they download it again :scratchch

zeugnimod

12th May 2006, 12:30

Until they download it again :scratchch

Lol! Maybe a little flaw in the concept. :tilt: :p

Fetzo

12th May 2006, 12:55

omg wrong thread sorry!

*very fast edit!*

spsamsp

12th May 2006, 15:03

[quote=mrodgers]Excellent idea [quote]

+1

Cue-Ball

12th May 2006, 17:13

Plus , putting the drag strip in may convince some of the demo racers to buy the game. Once they notice they can drive a 490hp car on a 8 lane drag strip , they could get interested.

Just my 2 eurocents. What do you think ? (you can start flaming now)Bad idea. Bad, bad, BAD idea. Adding another track won't get rid of the wreckers at all. Not at all sure how you came to this conclusion. The only way to get rid of wreckers is to either be able to ban them (you can do that now, but they can come right back after an IP refresh) or make wrecking so costly that people avoid it (something like nK's "hard core mode" where repairs happen in real time). Even the latter would not prevent wreckers completely as they could join a server, wreck out some people, then change servers. Really, proper banning is the only good solution.

In addition, people already play the demo version of the game for YEARS without buying the full version. The last thing they should do is add content to the demo.

Hahni

12th May 2006, 17:35

Isnt the hole wrecker problem , caused by to many people play the demo instead of buying a S2 license ?

bal00

12th May 2006, 22:09

If anything, the people that do stick around on the demo servers for longer are usually the drivers who keep demo racing clean. Plus, it's not like people only race there because they don't have a license. Many license-holders simply enjoy the demo track/car combos and since these aren't too popular in S2, you use a demo server.

There are the occasional newbies that sit on the track or try going the wrong way, but in my experience they don't last very long. The real problem are the 5-10 retards who use the demo servers exclusively to wreak havoc. Text floods, impersonation, vote banning, wrecking...you name it.

Wildcard/hostmask bans would go a looong towards improving the online experience on the demo servers. Right now it really is needlessly frustrating. After all it's not like server admins don't know what it would take to get rid of these people, the problem is simply that they don't have the tools to do it.

IDUI

15th May 2006, 10:56

Yes, that is why having a trial time on the demo would hurt those, few, who race clean and are satisfied with the demo car/track combos.

I may have read the thread too fast, but I still don't see any reasons against having the demo as it is today plus the addition of demo servers that recquire players to have registered on the site, like one would have to for S1/S2(except no pay). These servers would be more managble and accesable to those who don't mind the registration prosses for the sake of a more admin managable environment.

...I know- I can't spell. :tilt:

newage

15th May 2006, 19:03

i still playing demo, cause £24 still kinda expensive to me. i like the idea of register, iam already register, the i could put my username and password, unlock the "demo mode" and play.

imo wreckers dont know how setup a car, dont understand mechanics of a car, dont enjoy driving/racing, all the wrecker i meet in demo, none of them realy play racing games, on chat they talk about, soccer game, mmorpg, fps, that king of game.

that what i have to say. tnks:)

duke_toaster

15th May 2006, 19:56

newage

15th May 2006, 23:27

24 quid isn't that expensive. Rfactor and NetKrap Pro are £30.

well, i didnt buy netkart neither rfactor license, iam saving money to buy a wheel first, so i can learn to drive and i wont be a slow car on a race track.

here in Brasil, £24 = R$96, on my last job(iam jobless now :shrug:) my salary was about R$450. so is quite expensive for a game.

BoDean_LP

30th November 2009, 19:45

well, i didnt buy netkart neither rfactor license, iam saving money to buy a wheel first, so i can learn to drive and i wont be a slow car on a race track.

here in Brasil, £24 = R$96, on my last job(iam jobless now :shrug:) my salary was about R$450. so is quite expensive for a game.

Sorry to hear that you're jobless. I'm looking for employment right now. I feel the same way. It's kind of too expensive for me, right now anyway. I'm lovin' the demo, and am compelled to buy a wheel just for the realism. For now, I'll just play the demo.

Why don't wreckers just go to the car park and wreak havoc there? That's what it's for, right?

AndroidXP

30th November 2009, 19:51

Holy thread-resurrection Batman!

Did you notice the post you replied to was made more than three and a half years ago?

danthebangerboy

30th November 2009, 20:09

Furthermore, in the time that has passed since this thread was first created, possibly before the dawn of time, :razz: demo users are now required to have a registered username. :thumb:

DavidTiger

30th November 2009, 20:12

:Looking_aLol thats pretty bad dude. 1st post and you decide to bumb a thread from over 3 years ago :x

:bump:

Ripley

30th November 2009, 20:24

Not considering the fact that, by now, NewAge from Brazil got a beautiful job and became RICH !!:rofl:

zeugnimod

30th November 2009, 20:46

It's a demo user with an avatar!

That's how old this thread is. :schwitz:

franky500

30th November 2009, 23:55

ok i know this is the norm "man this thread is old" sort of stuff.

But lets think of this another way.... if the user started a new thread i would put money on it that the response would be "use search... (link)" etc. or more likely "In Before The Lock"

If a thread bump is a bad thing.. whats the point in telling people to use the search features.....

Just something to think about.

EDIT: okay so this thread isn't the perfect example.. but im sure you get my point ;)

jasonmatthews

1st December 2009, 00:30

Fact is Dean, the search function sucks ballz big time, not once in the hundreds of times I have tried have I ever found anything I am looking for....

Aaaaannnnnndddd.....

You are completely correct, the same people who say "use the frigging search" are the same ones who say "way to bump an old thread noob!" :razz:

:Looking_aLol thats pretty bad dude. 1st post and you decide to bumb a thread from over 3 years ago :x

:bump:Buy a license you cheapskate haggis eater :D

ColeusRattus

1st December 2009, 06:36

Fact is Dean, the search function sucks ballz big time, not once in the hundreds of times I have tried have I ever found anything I am looking for....

Well, as with many computer related things, the search function is as good as the person using it. For me, it's very rare NOT to find what I'm looking for. ;)

DavidTiger

1st December 2009, 11:23

Buy a license you cheapskate haggis eater :D

Says the Welshman :x Haggis is great :tilt: A little drop of Whisky over it makes it all the better :thumb:

16th January 2010 - The day I leave Scotland and go 278 miles south.
I joined the RAF and that is my leaving date, RAF Cosford in Wolverhampton will be my home for the next 9 month. After that I could be based anywhere in the world :)
You see why I have no licence yet :shy:
Join Date: Feb 200910 month ago I joined, but if I never played it for about 7 months of that time, So I have just started playing the last few months and was going to buy a licence but didn't see the point if I was never to use it like 11 months of the year...
:schwitz:
Meh, If LFS and its community is around when I leave the RAF, Then I'd buy it :nod: by that time I would be able to by G25,27 or what ever is out by that time...