Thanks Scawen for the Skin compression option

[inCogNito]

Thanks for that option :)

in case someone wonders, i've attached a screen for comparison. It's both the same skin, and it's even worse if you use red color.
You can turn it off in the Graphics options.

:thumb:

[Tweaker]

Yes it is best option for skinners ;)

Also to point out (not related to this)... you can edit the color of the FOX's LCD display in the Display options menu at the bottom :D :D

[deggis]

Huh, this means just that skins can be over 400 kb now or what?

Downloadable 1024x1024 sized skins could have been better.

[Tweaker]

No, it just means that whenever you had a 100% quality skin in the game, it will no longer have artifacts on it, like shown in the lower part of that pic attached above.

Basically when viewing the skin in the viewer, you never got this auto-compression, but in the game it compressed it, making the skins look pixely. But now you can choose to not have this applied to your skins in the game... uses more memory, but for people that want good quality, this is great :up:

[DratsaB]

thanks for explaning this, i didnt quite understand it. I do now.

Sounds like a neat option :thumb:

[STROBE]

This is a good feature. :) Although I'm still holding out for in-game downloadable 1024 skins from LFSW one day. :thumb:

[dontsimon]

Um, so originally the default was uncompressed? Should I set it to compressed for better performance in all cases?

[XCNuse]

im leaving mine compressed, i never have had any problems like you guys have, i dont know why, but i dont see those blotches ,... plus, even if i did, i doubt i would notice them while racing anyway

[inCogNito]

Um, so originally the default was uncompressed? Should I set it to compressed for better performance in all cases?

no, the default was compressed. it changed with S2 alpha, the alpha demo was uncompressed.

@XCNuse: i doubt that you don't have these artefacts, you may just not notice them

[Gopher04]

Personally i think its time to allow 1024x1024 skins to be uploaded without being resized, the Dev's said the 512x512 resizing is a trial for the auto uploader when they first brought it in, now this uploader has proved itself as very effiecent and very fast, so for us skinners who like quality please allow us to upload at 1024x1024..:thumb: :nod: im guessing two options could be added at lfsworld, you tick the one you want when uploading your skin, tick here for 512, and here for 1024...

[Tweaker]

1024 was never permitted simply because it just takes up too much memory for the kind of systems this game supports. I mean... this game is DirectX 8 engine, and many 4 to 5 year old computers can still run this game, but they'd need low res textures.

I know that many people should have newer systems by now, and a 1024 option would be really nice for the people that can make it possible without performance issues... but I do remember Victor saying that the bandwidth issue on LFSW is the problem. If the 1024 skins were uncompressed and allowed on LFSW, that would mean we would have 400 to 500 kb sized skins to download, and we all know what happens when people start downloading large chunks of files online when playing in servers.... LAG. If the 1024 skins were compressed in LFSW even, it wouldn't help, skins would still tend to be around 200kb average, and not only that, you could download three to four 1024 sized skins in that time... way more efficient by having skins of that size.

As said many times before, ask someone for their hires skin if it is so important. You go and race online, and hardly need to spend time focusing on high quality skins, the low quality size is fine, looks ok within visible range when driving beside them, and on track cameras. I don't see the big need for the high quality skins other than for screenshots or if you are REALLY anal about quality of people's skins.... when the majority of public skins are crap... and only personal. Absolutely inneficient to have the global feature of downloading 1024 skins, when if you are in a dire need, ask for the skin. If you cannot get the high quality skin, so what!

For how quick and easy the quick download feature is, it is rather painless and less problematic. I would only prefer seeing the 1024 option once a new graphics engine is made... as that would suit faster computers by then.

[Pablo.CZ]

If the 1024 skins were uncompressed and allowed on LFSW, that would mean we would have 400 to 500 kb sized skins to download, and we all know what happens when people start downloading large chunks of files online when playing in servers.... LAG.
Very easy solution.. allow upload skins upto 300kB (for example) AND do autodownload only if race/quali not in progress => who cares about lag in garage?

Please allow 1024 skin donwload!

[Tweaker]

Please allow 1024 skin donwload!

But think about this... why is it so important to have everyone's public skins at 1024 size BESIDES having better quality? What else do you benefit from it?

Tell me please, because I see no benefits other than quality, while at the same time it makes a lot more sacrifices in return.

[Gopher04]

Yes the benifits are only quality, but whats wrong with that..you cant create a high quality skin at 512, due to resizing of decal and so on, you have to make it so god dam small, 1024 is a ideal size for skinning, and alot of time and work goes into creating some skins, and espically team ones, so why should they get wrecked in the upload, Devs said it was a test, so fair enough, so lets do another test and leave them at 1024, now i understand about some people can't afford to have hi res skins being uploaded, so why can't we have a choice, personally i dont think it will make a difference in upload speed grabbing them, i've never suffered lag from it, and alot of people would love to see skins in their full glory, but thats why a choice should happen, i don't mind being limited to 400kb, thats fine, but being resized to 512, that is stupied, it just destroys the quality...and the effort some people put in..

[Pablo.CZ]

Tell me please, because I see no benefits other than quality, while at the same time it makes a lot more sacrifices in return.
Yes, main benefit is quality. Why I have powerful PC, nice graphics in game, making hi-res skins and in the end, I see 19 ugly cars + 1 mine?
What about replays, screenshots a videos? Its part of promotion and nobody wants ugly smudged game graphics in 2006. Ive 256MB videocard and 40MB used, why?
And no sacrifices in return if download wont be allowed during race and if 512x512 default option be there for slower machines.

[Tweaker]

There are more upsides to having 512 versus the quality it gives you. That is all I can say. 1024 is the other way around. And honestly, the game and LFSW should not just be some large file download middle-man, all for the sake of quality that makes a visible difference at 10 meters from the car :zombie:

I am picky about quality too, I love quality looking cars in racing sims, but I sure as hell do not see why there is a dire need for public 1024 skins through LFSW... especially since what we have right now works so well. I am almost thinking of making LFS-Files to have a 'skin-dump' section which could allow people to freely upload their high quality skins, and maybe check if it is on LFSW. It would just be a big database of everyone's skins, but the used space would grow immensely on the server, and bandwidth would be crushed for our site -- I would need to think of some sort of clever Torrent tracker thingy, dunno.

Having 1024 downloadable ingame is ultimately Scawen and Victor's decision. Scawen doesn't like to have any high quality 1024 sized skins included with the game because he wants to keep performance levels sane, and Victor knows that the 512 skin upload is a test, and already the used space is huge, and if it were to stretch the boundaries, it is likely to cause problems. I think such a 1024 download feature would have to be the works of a community site. So I may consider this, but it will stall LFS-Files development and release time, so maybe for later.

[Becky Rose]

I would like 1024 skins. My computer runs LFS with 40% idle on 1 CPU and the other not doing anything, and the 2 graphics cards barely wake up at the sight of the LFS icon being clicked.

LFS is a great game but there is a lot of room for improvement in the graphics. We've had some improvement in the latest patch - the tyres are now great and I love having the tyre decals so I can see when i've locked up, but it would be nice to see the small print on everyone elses skin.

With 1024 skins we could start putting on those small logo's near the wheel, details like the senna S on a williams and so on.

[Matrixi]

I'm all up for 1024 sized auto-downloadable skins. The time it takes to download can be suffered in the sake of the quality. Today I did a comparison with my FOX skin, I made it to be 2048 size originally, then I looked at the 512 sized version downloaded from LFSW, and man, it was so horrible. Then I checked what 1024 size looks like and there was barely any noticable difference to 2048.

So, please, allow 1024 skins auto-download. Or make an option between 512/1024 for those who don't have modern hardware/fast internet connection for it.

[STROBE]

@ Tweak: I've no doubt that one of the principal barriers to not having 1024 LFSW downloads is the bandwidth and server requirements. However bandwidth and storage space is constantly getting cheaper which is why one day I'd expect to see this included. 512 textures are noticeably blurry and although they're fine for racing in a 5 lap GTR/BF1 blast at Aston National, they're not up to scratch for slower races, viewing replays, taking screenshots, or comparing to other modern games/sims (be it driving, flying, shooting, or whatever).

512 textures might be fine for some people, either those with limited bandwidth (there are still plenty dialup/256/512k connections in the world), limited hd space, or limited gfx memory. But many people aren't limited in such ways and would prefer crisper, clearer skins. If the sacrifices are so great, as you suggest, then many would switch back to 512 skins anyway (assuming it was included as an option to choose between 512 and 1024 downloads).

[Tweaker]

f the sacrifices are so great, as you suggest, then many would switch back to 512 skins anyway (assuming it was included as an option to choose between 512 and 1024 downloads).
Yeah but the sacrifices are not entirely on our side, it is LFSW that is the workhorse too. I know you said HD space and bandwidth is becoming cheaper, but to have this sort of upgrade, there is an expense to be paid by the devs. So it is not as easy as 1,2,3 when you give an option to go with 512 or 1024, the ultimate test is that of LFSW. If it was unsatisfying, they'd have to go back to 512 only.

[XCNuse]

keep the 512, is it REALLY that importat? are you like ... OMG they have a 'such and such' decal thats about size 2 font on their car ..... BAN!

i see nothing better about having 1024 except loss of HD space as said before

i mean, lets not turn LFS into some whos better at graphics design competition; its not like we're all just sitting in spectator mode criticizing everyone's skin.. i mean.. honestly, if you want the 1024 resolution... just ask for it

i honestly see nothing great (or good that you would get from doing this) about being able to get the 1024 sized skins.. nothing..
skins look fine to me when im racing, they only look a little blotchy when im watching in spectator, but even then.. its only on the small little details

[Tweaker]

And this topic about requesting 1024 sized skins has come up quite often (several threads already) ever since the feature was implemented in the game.

Looks to me like the idea of having 1024 skins available is the least of their plans or worries.

[GianniC]

I like it still, I don't watch those details on people skins when racing and now I finally get a better fps ! So I'm gratefull for this option.

[inCogNito]

I like it still, I don't watch those details on people skins when racing and now I finally get a better fps ! So I'm gratefull for this option.

the options was there the whole time since S2, but now you can disable it!
It was on all the time!

[XCNuse]

yes, but somehow there have been many people that say they are getting higher FPS'

[Sawyer]

I dont know why we dont get an option to host our own HI Res skins anyway? I mean everyone has probably a webhost from his ISP with at last 10MB web space. OR most even have big upload them self and if you would enable download high res skins in your game and the client would have one to offer whats the deal?
You would just write an url somewhere in the game where others would automatically download just like from LFSW right now.

[Eldanor]

Maybe it is to avoid slow connections that could cause lag...who knows

[Julppu]

If 512 isn't enough, then why stop at 1024?

[Becky Rose]

I'm still holding out for in-game downloadable 1024 skins from LFSW one day.
+1 BUT make the choice to download 1024^2 textures optional.

2048^2 would be an improvement again, but visually the improvement is not worth the 4x filesize of going to 2x^2 the resolution in my opinion. I think 1024 allows enough detail on the cars. 512 textures look stretched to me, they are clearly a compromise when you look at them in game.

I appreciate some people run LFS on old heaps of junk, but I dont, and i'd like the option of using my computers full power. Sure let the "poor" people who can afford a half decent computer, monthly broadband and LFS to play the game, but let me play it with the options turned up on my PC too please ! :)

Currently LFS assumes we are all on computers from half a decade ago, and that just is not true.

[SchneeFee]

if u have time to tell the difference while driving u are definetly too slow. (or u are racing an uf1:razz:)

[Becky Rose]

if u have time to tell the difference while driving u are definetly too slow. (or u are racing an uf1
I actually feel that is wrong, If you dont have time to take in what you are seeing you are clearly driving in a formula that is too fast for you.

[SchneeFee]

well, then the cars i race are too fast for me.

[Becky Rose]

Yah, try sail boat racing, there's a link in my current sig - then you will see what bad textures look like at low speed! ;)... (specifically, the textures I drew!)

[spankmeyer]

+1 BUT make the choice to download 1024^2 textures optional.

2048^2 would be an improvement again, but visually the improvement is not worth the 4x filesize of going to 2x^2 the resolution in my opinion. I think 1024 allows enough detail on the cars. 512 textures look stretched to me, they are clearly a compromise when you look at them in game.

I appreciate some people run LFS on old heaps of junk, but I dont, and i'd like the option of using my computers full power. Sure let the "poor" people who can afford a half decent computer, monthly broadband and LFS to play the game, but let me play it with the options turned up on my PC too please ! :)

Currently LFS assumes we are all on computers from half a decade ago, and that just is not true.

I'm sorry sweetie, but the world doesn't revolve around you. :smileypul You want the skin server to send bigger files? Then buy more licences to cover the dev's increasing bandwith bills. :)

[Becky Rose]

Did I miss the post from the devs saying they cannot afford it? I dont see it anywhere.

If bandwidth really is an issue then we can look at other solutions, perhaps having a premium LFS world account as an optional extra or something like that?

[spankmeyer]

Did I miss the post from the devs saying they cannot afford it? I dont see it anywhere.

If bandwidth really is an issue then we can look at other solutions, perhaps having a premium LFS world account as an optional extra or something like that?

Yes, you are partly right that devs haven't mentioned whether there are financial reasons involved, but it seems only logical that bigger files = more bandwith consumed = more £££ to keep things running. :)
Like mentioned before in the thread, the 512x512 limit was for testing purposes when S2 Alpha first came around. Not many people have had problems with automatic skin downloading - and thanks to solid code and design - the side-effects of file swapping between server and player are barely visible to end user. I guess Victor knows if the skin server has actually been struggling during peak hours and if more reserve is needed in the future.

Peace! :)

EDIT: Fixed typos.

[P5YcHoM4N]

Yah, try sail boat racing, there's a link in my current sig - then you will see what bad textures look like at low speed! ;)... (specifically, the textures I drew!)
Helps if any of the download links work ;)

Sending 512 over LFSW doesn't need to be changed, as pretty much every skin on there is in the skins section here anyway, so if you want 1024 grab it from there.

Don't get me wrong, eye candy can be nice (why else do I have a PC worth more then a small car), but who needs such eye candy in LFS? The only we need custom skins is you know who's race you just screwed up because you over brake on a corner and they back ended you.

[Becky Rose]

Helps if any of the download links work
The archive of old versions is offline because i'm out of hosting space atm, the current version works, or at least it should. Anyway this is offtopic.

ending 512 over LFSW doesn't need to be changed, as pretty much every skin on there is in the skins section here anyway, so if you want 1024 grab it from there.
Is that really true? I havn't uploaded any of the skins I have made, I showed a couple of screenies of some of my latest skins the other day, but i've not put the skins themselves up for download and that's because they are personal/team skins and not for general use. I'm sure other skinners do the same, there seem to be many hundreds of personal skins in LFS from what i've seen, and although i've not looked extensively through the skins section - I think only the F1 skins I have seen used in game.

who needs such eye candy in LFS?
I dont need it. I want it. I have the hardware for the game to be prettier and this strikes me as a very small programming change which will go some way to achieving that.

but it seems only logical that bigger files = more bandwith consumed = more £££ to keep things running.
Bandwidth is now an aweful lot cheaper than it was just a couple of years ago. Two years ago entry level web hosting would set you back £30 a month and get you a maximum of 1gb a month transfered from your site, now you can get the same hosting for £20 a year (example: http://www.xrshosting.com).

And as I said, i'd personally be willing to pay for a premium LFS World account to let me have the higher res skins and I am sure that some (certainly not all) other users would feel the same. I spend a lot of time in LFS, so it seems like money well spent.

Do 1024^2 skins make a difference? Not on everyones skin, frankly some are aweful and if I could scale them to 1 pixel by 1 pixel I would! lol... But some skins are fantastic and i'd rather seem them in their full glory, especially so in the saloon classes where the back of the cars skin is fully visible, I also enjoy watching half a dozen or so replays from most nights racing.

[Tweaker]

512 skins are quicker to download too. I don't think it's about the hosting bandwidth, it is about everyone downloading skins while online too. Some tremendous lag can be caused from even downloading a batch of 512 skins from LFSW. If we had loads of 1024, it wouldn't be fast, and I am guessing quite problematic for people with slower connections and/or just unstable connections. The 512 download is fairly quick, but not as fast as you think it could be. 1024 would slow it down, I am sure of it. Plus, your 1024 skin would HAVE to be compressed by LFSW, no doubt. Because they are in excess of 300-400kb in size on average, and there would have to be some filesize cap for that. There have been nearly 1mb 1024 sized skins, and there is no way LFSW would support that. And as we've seen, the LFS sites are not so fond of high bandwidth. (Well LFS.net and LFSW are hosted on 2 different boxes and locations).

So, all I can say is what the devs have already said. It is a test with the 512 for now, and if it seems ok, they might consider using higher res. I still think 512 is nothing to complain about while online anyways. You get a sense of what their skin looks like, and it adds to the racing atmosphere. I could care less if their skins were higher quality. I'd rather manually go download high quality skins of my choosing.

[Vykos69]

simple point, becky: 1024^2 skin is 4times bigger in filesize as 512^2. That's already quite a lot. And atm it's just a compromise, to suit all people.

[Becky Rose]

Yes I appreciate it's double the quality for four times the file size, I shouldn't think storage size is an issue on the server ... hard disks are dirt cheap these days, and bandwidth as we've covered doesn't cost much and I for one would be happy to pay a small premium for it.

The issue Tweaker raises with skin downloads causing delays is something to talk about though.

I notice when I log on to a server it can be a bit jittery whilst I am still spectating, I think LFS uses more bandwidth for skins when spectating, this doesnt really matter - if the skins where larger it just meens this laggy period which is what, 10-20 seconds or so at the moment, would be 40-80 seconds. There's no real loss there.

Once you get in the car I think LFS gives less bandwidth to skin downloading and the effect seems less noticeable, so the real difference would be that skins took longer to appear on other cars.

Sure it's a compromise, 5 years from now we might be talking about 4096^2 skins and moaning that things could be higher quality! :) I just would like the option of having higher quality skins.

[DEVIL 007]

simple point, becky: 1024^2 skin is 4times bigger in filesize as 512^2. That's already quite a lot. And atm it's just a compromise, to suit all people.
MAybe I am blind but when I made test there is no 4x times difference in size between 512*512 and 1024*1024 at all.
1024*1024 askin can be compressed by JPEG at very,very high quality around 400-500KB.

I think it wouldnt be bad idea to have possiblity to have a premium account which you would pay monthly/quaterly/yearly and have access to special features.Like better skins for online downloading and maybe some other cool futures which cost SCAVIER money or whatsoever so they cant support it atm.

There are more and more poeple who want better graphics because they have powerfull machines/internet connections.Why not to listen then and give it to them.

The LFS developing and comunity were always about listening to others and putting the nice ideas live.Thats what make this game top-notch.

[CrazyICE]

nice feature!
didn't recognized!
thx InC!

[DEVIL 007]

nice feature!
didn't recognized!
thx InC!
I am missing something...:pillepall

[BlackEye]

I am missing something...:pillepall

First post maybe?:smileypul

[DEVIL 007]

First post maybe?:smileypul
:banghead:

[Gopher04]

MAybe I am blind but when I made test there is no 4x times difference in size between 512*512 and 1024*1024 at all.
1024*1024 askin can be compressed by JPEG at very,very high quality around 400-500KB.

Devil is right, its not 4x the size, far from it, you can have the hi-res version which tops out around 700kb, using 1024x1024, as for causing delays, i wouldn't say that either, this auto up/down system the devs have come up with has proved itself with flying colours, i reckon if they allowed upto a max of 800kb per skin that would be ample..

[Becky Rose]

(512^2) x 4 = 1024^2
In memory the image is 4 times the area for double the size because it's doubled in two directions, if jpg compression happens to be giving similar filesizes for 512^2 and 1024^2 then that's jolly good, but does that apply with a full (99%) quality jpg?

I cannot check until tommorow, but I suspect if the ratio of the filesize is somewhat dependant upon the content of the skin itself and may change with some skin designs.

Personally I couldn't care if the skins where 2mb a piece, i'd still download them at full res :). That's beauty of investing in your past time :).

[DEVIL 007]

(512^2) x 4 = 1024^2
In memory the image is 4 times the area for double the size because it's doubled in two directions, if jpg compression happens to be giving similar filesizes for 512^2 and 1024^2 then that's jolly good, but does that apply with a full (99%) quality jpg?

I cannot check until tommorow, but I suspect if the ratio of the filesize is somewhat dependant upon the content of the skin itself and may change with some skin designs.

Personally I couldn't care if the skins where 2mb a piece, i'd still download them at full res :). That's beauty of investing in your past time :).
There is difference if we are talking about downloading the skins from LFSworld or storing them into memory.In the 1st case the file size of 1024*1024 is not 4 times bigger then 512*512.In the second case Vykos and you are right.

The jpeg compression really destroy the images more from 90percent down but at this value the skin looks completly same as 99 procent unless you compare it at pixel view:D .

And you are also right with your assumptation about the content affect skin file size.The more colours areas is used the less is compression effective.

As I said there are nowdays a lot of guys with good hardware so why no give them the option to have the best of they want.

[ORION]

Just tested it with the ZT BF1, Picture publisher and 95% quality:
512 - 62 KB - 100%
1024 - 158 KB - 255%
2048 - 394 KB - 635%

Thus the amount of Pixels is 4 times as much, the jpg filesize only 3 times.

[ksa_land]

hi,

first, I didn't read all the post, sorry.

I think while racing online it's not necessary to have 1024-skins, because you are focused on racing.

But sometimes you watch replays or even make movies. For this case it would be nice to have an option to download 1024-skins or 2048-skins :) before starting the replay.

Like: "Do you wish to download hires-skins?" --> "yes" or "no"

Similar to the option to download the skin from lfs-world when a skin is missing in the replay.


A download of the 1024-skins while you are in the pit or viewing the race would maybe a solution to download while being online.

cu :tilt:

[spankmeyer]

My suggestion to stop the bitching about silly texture sizes: integrate vector art plugin to LFS and dump bitmap skins. Lossless scalable quality and filesizes down to few kbs. That's the ticket right there! :thumb:

EDIT: Before someone starts to preach to the choir about bitmap vs. vector, I put the whole thing in sarcasm mode.

[EeekiE]

Simple solution. Integrate 512 vs 1024 in with graphics settings in the game first of all so it's an end user choice for viewing.
Then, force users to host 1024 versions of their skins on their own domain, and simply submit a link to LFSWorld for this.
Just as the Unreal Tournament engine allows you to store maps on a "redirect" server so you don't lag the server if you join without the map, only yourself.

Everybody happy.

Except the developers. :tilt:


EDIT: And just imagine, the people without webhosting will have "imageshack" sponsor stickers randomly on their car :razz:

[Davo]

512 look fine ingame. I'm not gawking at people skins until after the race anyway and honestly most of them suck. My skins folder is huge from all the skins. Most teams post up their hi res skins for download so I get them when I can.

[ajp71]

I actually feel that is wrong, If you dont have time to take in what you are seeing you are clearly driving in a formula that is too fast for you.

I feel that is very wrong if you are looking at the rear of another car sufficently hard to notice the difference in skin quality then you seriously need to pay more attention to the road.

[Becky Rose]

I feel that is very wrong if you are looking at the rear of another car sufficently hard to notice the difference in skin quality then you seriously need to pay more attention to the road.
All of the people that I race with on a regular basis I have high quality skins for, and the difference is noticeable. It makes the game look about 2 years newer.

[Fordman]

Looks to me like the idea of having 1024 skins available is the least of their plans or worries.

Maybe not their's but for teams, its top of our list to look as sexy as possible :shrug:

Majority of PC's ( I am guessing now ) due to LFS DX8 engine, can run LFS at full compacity with no problems. Hell I am running a FX5500 and running at full res with AAx2 and AFx4 and its good to go?

Do 1024 skins really they make much of a difference ( compared to if you are using Dons and Mr Political's Skies :D ) which are 4048 or something like that?

As you said tweak, maybe 1024 skins are to much for lfsworld, and thus should be moved to elsewhere, but then you get away from it being centralised, and going back to how it was ( not having skins shown, etc etc )

Just as long as the files are not of a stupid size ( kb's ) then I beleive 1024 skins should replace the pixaled, fuzzy 512 skins.

Just my opinion

[Goop]

If you dont have time to take in what you are seeing you are clearly driving in a formula that is too fast for you.

old post, yeah, but I really disagree. The paint job on the car next to you is completely irrelevant at speed ;)

[EeekiE]

Old post = people moaning about old post.
New post = people moaning about searching for old posts :shrug:

Why should I care whether YOU think 512 is enough? I don't.
I think the game is far more immersive when you can see the finest detail on the small logos on people cars, and I don't need people to tell me that I don't find it more immersive, because I do. That isn't the issue.

It's like saying you should have LOD right down on everything, uninstall all the reflection mods, all the higher texture mods, because you shouldn't be looking at nice round wheels etc when you're just about to go flying past someone because you're so super awesome :thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb:


Maybe someone could write a mod that checks a 3rd party database for 1024x1024 skins and downloads and overwrites if applicable. I'll host them if needs be?

Or even something really simple that just syncs with a webfolder that everyone uploads to?

[Dupson]

sorry for being rude but..........

........whats next ? you goin to put a bilinearfiletered tarmac and unfiltered as a jpg here and then write
"Thanks for texture filtering Scaven!!"

and then all the users of NFS will write :
"Thanks for car reflections E A !" or "thanks for antianlasing dear graphic cards producers ! "

sorry .. i had to :P :pillepall

[Doorman]

All of the people that I race with on a regular basis I have high quality skins for, and the difference is noticeable. It makes the game look about 2 years newer.
Have to agree. All the skins I make for our lot, I keep a 2048^ copy for my skins folder. Maybe it's egotism, but I like to see the work I've done, as I've done it. :shrug: For the rest, there are a few skins that I'd like better resolutions for but it's not THAT important. Choice is good though.

[StanleyCarter]

I've thought of this before when the skin autodownload feature just started.. here goes..

What do you guys think of having the driver suit as downloable skins as well?
We have car skins, then with S2 we have helmet skins, so how about driver suits as well, the suits are currently stored in a separate folder and they're editable, but they're limited to few suits only, and once you changed the suit to your own likings (e.g team suit), everyone else may be wearing the same suit as you as it's still under the same file name.

I know this idea may not be too visible as it will take up too much capacity, but wouldn't it be nice to have downloadable driver suit skins?

[EeekiE]

sorry for being rude but..........

........whats next ? you goin to put a bilinearfiletered tarmac and unfiltered as a jpg here and then write
"Thanks for texture filtering Scaven!!"

and then all the users of NFS will write :
"Thanks for car reflections E A !" or "thanks for antianlasing dear graphic cards producers ! "

sorry .. i had to :P :pillepall

No. But a realistic skin texture should be able to have small sponsor style motifs and logos.

Yes I do think physics, and driving are FAR more important, but I just don't see why everyone's objecting like it's a BAD thing, and it shouldn't ever be done. It's ISN'T a bad thing. It would make the custom skin feature perfect, which is a BIG part of racing too I think. Everyone has their unique design, and I think race cars in race paint are beautiful things.

Why is everyone seemingly against it, even though it would obviously be a selectable thing, like any graphics option.

[Goop]

i'm certainly not against it. I do object, however, to a suggestion that I should drive a different (read: slower) formula simply because I find texture resolution irrelevant when racing side-by-side with someone. I only need to know where they are in relation to my car.

And EeekiE, as for my 'old post, but' comment, I felt a little silly responding to Becky's old statement, but sorta had to anyhow :D. No qualms on the resurrection of the thread itself; i missed it the first time around :cyclops:

[EeekiE]

No worries man. I think I misread it.

I guess such a thing will be an S3 addition if at all. As as far as I'm aware, S3 is all about the media improvements or something.
The amount of high res textures, reflection mods, and skyboxes show that the player-base would like to push the visual immersion further. The wanting of high res skins is no different. Whether you think it's required or not is irrelevant. Just as I bet there are a lot of players that are more than happy with standard world textures, and standard LOD.

It's all about where you draw the line. The engine COULD just display boxes with wheels for cars, and a simple black strip with curbs layed in a big green field for tracks, and a big expanse of blue for a sky, and still handle and race exactly the same. I bet some people wouldn't mind, "as you're not supposed to be looking at car vertices, clouds, or scenery when you're racing" I think, and I bet most people think that would be rubbish though. Then I and a lot of others just go one further think the line should/could be drawn a little further on, and include car textures that allow you to use life size, readable car sponsor stickers.

[PaulC2K]

Whats the problem with people saying that the request for access to the 1024 sized skins were FORCED to upload (the stupid thing wont take 512/2048 or anything else!) and allow those who WANT to download them actually download them?

We're being asked to pay for Premium pubstats by the Mb, so clearly a price tag can be put onto the downloading something from the LFS Servers, so why cant we be billed for the downloaded skins if we want to?
Nobody is demanding 1024 to replace 512, but the option just like Skin compression and half the settings in LFS are the there for the users choice, i dont hear anyone complaining about these options, so whats wrong with an option for this?

Its also really sh*tty trying to get screenshots from events when half the cars in-shot look ugly as sin because your only allowed to see the blocky 512 versions.
The 'its not a screenshot taker' people can save there comments to themselves too.

Unless the option is going to harm part of the structure or experience then why do suggestions have to be shot-down just because some people have an opposing view. It doesnt harm the folk with there slow PCs & dial up, and asside from the possible additional costs for LFSW sending the data, i dont see why as an option it has be dismissed. Rarely agree with Becky's comments as they tend to be far too serious, but for once its pretty much bang on, its one of the aspects that ages LFS, and as there arent many things we can do to improve the visual aspects this is one thing that can be worked on.

Personally i'd like to see 4 options, dont get any, get 512's, get 1024's, and user selection. Theres plenty of crappy skins i wouldnt want 1024s the 512s are bad enough, but after a race it'd be nice to be able to select certain drivers skins to download a hi-res version. If i could pick and choose which skins i wanted, then yes i'd pay a premium rate to do this, I have for LFSW Pubstats and so have many others, why not include this into LFS?
Its got to be a better & more worthwhile use of time than SMS messaging, right?

[JJ72]

Without reading the thread....... I'll say only 5% of the skin I have seen online worth a 1024x1024 resolution. If this does happen, maybe it should only be reserved for a previleged group of skilled skinners who actually produce quality skins.

[Becky Rose]

I just dont want to see blurry unreadable text and unrecogniseable small logo's around wheel arches.

Disagree with me all you like, but to sway my opinion you'll have to explain why LFS uses cars with 10,000 polygons when most of the time the most that is ever drawn is just over 1,000, instead Eric slaves away making a model with 10 times the detail, why?

Because sometimes you do see it.

[EeekiE]

You don't need... simply isn't an argument. You don't need trees, you don't need textures, you don't need gear whine sound, you don't need cars over 6 polygons for a car. It's not a case of need. If people think it's utterly unnecessary, then why haven't there been any low texture quality packs released? Why not write a pack that replaces every grass texture with a block of green, and all tarmac textures with a block of grey. You don't need them afterall. I mean, you shouldn't be spending your time looking at patches of grass when you're racing should you....?:really:

[alland44]

1024 was never permitted simply because it just takes up too much memory for the kind of systems this game supports. I mean... this game is DirectX 8 engine, and many 4 to 5 year old computers can still run this game, but they'd need low res textures.

I know that many people should have newer systems by now, and a 1024 option would be really nice for the people that can make it possible without performance issues... but I do remember Victor saying that the bandwidth issue on LFSW is the problem. If the 1024 skins were uncompressed and allowed on LFSW, that would mean we would have 400 to 500 kb sized skins to download, and we all know what happens when people start downloading large chunks of files online when playing in servers.... LAG. If the 1024 skins were compressed in LFSW even, it wouldn't help, skins would still tend to be around 200kb average, and not only that, you could download three to four 1024 sized skins in that time... way more efficient by having skins of that size.

As said many times before, ask someone for their hires skin if it is so important. You go and race online, and hardly need to spend time focusing on high quality skins, the low quality size is fine, looks ok within visible range when driving beside them, and on track cameras. I don't see the big need for the high quality skins other than for screenshots or if you are REALLY anal about quality of people's skins.... when the majority of public skins are crap... and only personal. Absolutely inneficient to have the global feature of downloading 1024 skins, when if you are in a dire need, ask for the skin. If you cannot get the high quality skin, so what!

For how quick and easy the quick download feature is, it is rather painless and less problematic. I would only prefer seeing the 1024 option once a new graphics engine is made... as that would suit faster computers by then.

Sometimes, a couple of years ago, somebody made a programme which could download all the skins available, to your skin folder.

Then one wouldn`t have the problem online :)

Maby an auto update, before connecting to a server, would solve the problems !?

[Boris Lozac]

Wait, don't understand this one very well...
If i set this option to "compressed", will i download other people's skin via auto download faster, and with less lagg while doing that, or what? If that's the case, than i will set to compress, because sometimes when someone joins and his skin is being downloaded, the cars are lagging.. so..

[SamH]

Boris, nope. You download the 512px version to your PC regardless. The skin is FURTHER compressed (if the option is selected) when applied in-game to your car. This is because the graphics card in everyone's machine is different, and LFS supports a wide range of graphics cards and capabilities. In order to view the 512px (or 1024px, if it were available) version of everyone's skins in a race, you need a graphics card with a fair amount of RAM. In a 20 car race, if I have 1024px skins for everyone's car, my FPS takes a significant hit. In one race, I had 2048px versions. The result was 1fps until all the other cars were completely out of sight. I have an XFX nVidia 6600GT with 128Mb RAM.

Some people have fat broadband connections, dual-core CPUs and SLI graphics. If they want the option to have hi-res skins, I can't argue with that. Perhaps, as time passes and bandwidth is at less of a premium, this option may be available from LFSWorld. I've no idea. If it ever becomes an option for people to choose, I think it'll be cool

[Boris Lozac]

Boris, nope. You download the 512px version to your PC regardless. The skin is FURTHER compressed (if the option is selected) when applied in-game to your car. This is because the graphics card in everyone's machine is different, and LFS supports a wide range of graphics cards and capabilities. In order to view the 512px (or 1024px, if it were available) version of everyone's skins in a race, you need a graphics card with a fair amount of RAM. In a 20 car race, if I have 1024px skins for everyone's car, my FPS takes a significant hit. In one race, I had 2048px versions. The result was 1fps until all the other cars were completely out of sight. I have an XFX nVidia 6600GT with 128Mb RAM.

Some people have fat broadband connections, dual-core CPUs and SLI graphics. If they want the option to have hi-res skins, I can't argue with that. Perhaps, as time passes and bandwidth is at less of a premium, this option may be available from LFSWorld. I've no idea. If it ever becomes an option for people to choose, I think it'll be cool

Ah... ok, thanks.