slow starters

[Rappa Z]

I was racing on [FM] Oval Junkles and it is a great server.:D Just that when i start some of my races the guy (or girl) in front of me barely moves or don't even hit the gas.:pillepall It annoys me when i have a chance for a top 3 and the guy (or girl) in front tries to wait untill everyone passes but they just make one of those pile ups that causes restarts.Y don't they go?:shrug:

[XCNuse]

why else would you be afraid to take off from 0mph in the FV8?

they may be AFK too.. never know, thats just annoying... it happens, it happens in life, a car may stall

[Gabkicks]

lol another quality thread :p

[Rappa Z]

except when it happens in real life there seems to be alot more space. After all it was a 23 car race

[Madman_CZ]

i feel your pain rappa. last time i was racing on a server i started something like 3rd and the guy didnt move infront of me so i ended up smashing into him even though i tried to avoid him/her....

but theres nothing u can do about that, mostly i think its the way lfs restarts races. People often pop to the toilet or to grab a drink,food or whatever and then suddenly everyone decideds to restart and they dont make it back in time with lfs giving you only 4 seconds to start a race......

but what can you do.... just shrug your shoulders and keep going

[Rappa Z]

but then i end up pitting like 10 other cars.

[Jakg]

I was racing on [FM] Oval Junkles and it is a great server.:D Just that when i start some of my races the guy (or girl) in front of me barely moves or don't even hit the gas.:pillepall It annoys me when i have a chance for a top 3 and the guy (or girl) in front tries to wait untill everyone passes but they just make one of those pile ups that causes restarts.Y don't they go?:shrug:thats not annoying, haivng someone give it full throttle, get an amzing first few metres, then spin it is the worst, and i bet it happens at every start on the oval, once there is one car in the middle of the track with smke hanging around, someone normally hits it, and somebody else tried to avoid it and spun, luckily, the further in the gird you are the less it hapens!

[Rappa Z]

i estimate 2 people a race crash at the start. About 6 a race crash overall.:(

[Frankmd]

why else would you be afraid to take off from 0mph in the FV8?

they may be AFK too.. never know, thats just annoying... it happens, it happens in life, a car may stall

Hopefully AFW if they're in an FV8...

[XCNuse]

Hopefully AFW if they're in an FV8...
indeed.. being AFK is only worse :tilt:

[Rappa Z]

dude i was just back in there and i gain 3 positions then a guy cuts across the entire track in a spin n' took out 9 cars.:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(

[tristancliffe]

The oval is populated by the worst drivers so it's only fair to assume that 'worst' means 'bad' to 'don't know how to accelerate', so it's not surprising.

Stick with tracks that require you to be awake and ne'er this problem shall strike.

[deggis]

Maybe just some newbies that don't know yet how simple and unrealistic the starting process is in LFS (I mean, you just need to push full throttle - no clutch etc).

[Hankstar]

I think going straight to full throttle is the problem here - you can't do that in the FO8 without facing the other way in about 0.1 seconds...I just avoid the public oval servers altogether these days (unless it's a UF1 draft battle) because it soon ends up as a restart fiesta with a bunch of abuse thrown in. The aero and tyre bugs don't add to the experience either.
TC has the right idea - tracks with more than two corners are the way to go..

[deggis]

I think going straight to full throttle is the problem here - you can't do that in the FO8 without facing the other way in about 0.1 seconds...
I know, I was speaking in general about that. Still they probably take it too "easy" if they're not aware of the massive wheelspin you can take in the starts.

[Jakg]

The oval is populated by the worst drivers so it's only fair to assume that 'worst' means 'bad' to 'don't know how to accelerate', so it's not surprising.

Stick with tracks that require you to be awake and ne'er this problem shall strike.no, the pros are VERY good, just at the start its very easy to crash with dirty air and inexperienced drivers!

[Rappa Z]

dam i am also mad that when starting in the back of a full grid u start in the turn on the strait.

[Stellios]

Im like that, im good with the FO8, but i cannot for the life of me get it going fast from a standing start, keep spinning the wheels too much and losing it.

Dont use that server really now anyways, i mostly play offline for fooling around when im bored.

[Gimpster]

I think going straight to full throttle is the problem here - you can't do that in the FO8 without facing the other way in about 0.1 seconds...I just avoid the public oval servers altogether these days (unless it's a UF1 draft battle) because it soon ends up as a restart fiesta with a bunch of abuse thrown in. The aero and tyre bugs don't add to the experience either.
TC has the right idea - tracks with more than two corners are the way to go..

:thumb:

I have to agree with Hankster on this one. Its a simple rule, its the same on the track as it as in real life on the street. The person who is physicaly behind in a wrech is 99% of the time at failt. I can not count the number of times I have had to use a slow takeoff or brake early in to a corner to not run over the car in front of me only, to have the car behind me run me over because they are in attentive or in flexable in their racing line to adjust to the dynamicly changing situation.

Simple rule, if you are following and the shit hits the fan and you become entangeled in it, IT'S YOUR FAULT!

Im like that, im good with the FO8, but i cannot for the life of me get it going fast from a standing start, keep spinning the wheels too much and losing it.

Dont use that server really now anyways, i mostly play offline for fooling around when im bored.

Stellios, adjust your gear ratios so that a full throttle start in the car will not cause the wheels to spin and use a mostly locked diff. The idea is to lower the avalable torque at the rear wheels in that gear.

[Jakg]

what if someone is alone with yoy behind, drafting, and they brake really early, before you can step out and over take them?

[wien]

mostly i think its the way lfs restarts races. People often pop to the toilet or to grab a drink,food or whatever and then suddenly everyone decideds to restart and they dont make it back in time with lfs giving you only 4 seconds to start a race......If people would just spectate or pit when they leave their computer, this would be a non-issue. We all know what happens when a race is restarted, so I don't see how this can be so difficult.

[NotAnIllusion]

Maybe everyone should be put to spectate automatically when there's a successful restart vote and only those who join then in say a 5-8 sec period will start the race. Since everyone would be expecting this it wouldn't be an inconvenience as such either.

[Gimpster]

what if someone is alone with yoy behind, drafting, and they brake really early, before you can step out and over take them?

Then you were not leaving enough space to provide you a margine of safety. Still Your Fault. This is the biggest complaint I have with the user comunity in Sim racing. Every one is so concerned with going as fast as they can that they don't plan for when things happen that are unexpected. In real life fear is the driving force behind this attitude of leaving room, in sim racing that is removed, but should not be.

Untill people in the sim comunity realise that if you want the sim racing experance to be like a real racing experance they will need to think and act like a real racer would, sim racing will continue to be like it is today with wrecks at the start and turn one, crazy insane overtaking attempts will still happen in the wrong places, and close racing will continue to be a crap shoot.

If you want sim racing to be close, fun and exciting then grow up, act like a real racer, show some respect to the other poeple on the track and act like there is more at stake then electrons and polygons. If you can't do that you have no reason to and no ground to complain.

Have a nice day.

[Stellios]

Stellios, adjust your gear ratios so that a full throttle start in the car will not cause the wheels to spin and use a mostly locked diff. The idea is to lower the avalable torque at the rear wheels in that gear.

Cheers for the tip about the diff, ive played around with the ratios a bit, but fiddling with the diff didnt even cross my mind :thumb:

[Hankstar]

what if someone is alone with yoy behind, drafting, and they brake really early, before you can step out and over take them?

If you're drafting someone at the oval, you have to wonder why the hell are they braking at all :D

If you're at a circuit, if you're drafting someone you should always leave room for error. When I'm in someone's slipstream I always plan to brake before they do. Here's why: as most of us would know, when in a slipstream you catch up due to less wind resistance. If you start to brake while in someone's slipstream, you still have less wind resistance so you won't slow down as fast as the guy in front of you - this is why so many rear-enders happen in LFS (and other online sims). People don't realise that you can't brake at the same point you usually do when you're drafting someone due to the extra momentum - your speedo/tacho may tell you you're only be going as fast as you usually do at that point of the track, but the lack of resistance means you're actually going faster (relatively). Also, braking a bit earlier than the guy you're chasing gives you a bit more time to set up your line and go for the pass. Try to brake early, pull out of the slipstream and use that extra momentum to slingshot in front of your opponent, but be aware of that extra momentum and don't overcook it...how many times have you seen someone just shoot by you with locked brakes after they've tried to outbrake you? And how many times have you laughed out loud at them as they put it into a wall and continued on your way? :D

On that topic, how many times have you been blamed for a wreck because the guy who hit you from behind left no room for error and then blamed you for braking early? Personally, too many to count. My thoughts on that are pretty simple: if someone's good enough a racer to catch you and draft you to try and pass, they should be good enough to pass safely. If they take you out, they only have themselves to blame. If they're as good as think they are, they should be able to carve through the field without wrecking people.

[BuddhaBing]

Bear in mind also that the braking points and racing lines that you use aren't necessarily the same as those used by other people; some people like to brake early and gently while others like to be brake late and hard. So if you're following someone into a corner, you should be prepared for them to brake and turn-in earlier than you might. This is especially important when you're racing against complete strangers and haven't yet had a chance to get to know their driving style.

[Ball Bearing Turbo]

LOL@ Hankstar :D

On a similar note as people shooting past you with locked brakes (which really does make me laugh out loud as you stated), it's equally as funny to watch someone in front of you try and push that much harder as you gain on them. If I am a few carslengths behind someone, almost invariably they have an off within a lap or maybe two at the most. Just from the mental pressure I guess. I'm not the fastest guy around right now for sure, but I've been in the top three on many crowded races just by being consistent and putting a little pressure on drivers in front. I think consistency is the key...

[Hankstar]

I think it's the funniest damn thing in the world. This one time (not at band camp) it was a dude in an FXO who spent most of the first lap beeping at me (in my XRT) to let him by - yes, on the first lap - he even had "faster driver coming through" as a chat bind. After the race he decided I was worth abusing for holding him up (ie covering my line) - the other racers and I had to educate this poor fool that you can't expect anyone to yield unless they're being lapped, and that it was in the FIA rules. Then we had to tell him what the FIA was :D
The next race, the rematch of the century, he did exactly as I described above: drafted me very closely (with his lights on), tried to outbrake me at the end of the back straight at Blackwood on lap 1, flew straight past in a blaze of smoking glory (I knew his big move was coming and I left him all the room in the world to pass btw), ended up in the sand, cursing, received a customary "ah-HOO-gah" and a tap of the "good pass" key from me and some smilies from the other racers...and promptly disconnected and I've never seen him again. Just wish we all had Teamspeak that day so he could hear me LMAO :D I hope since then he's figured out the difference between a good racer and a good lapper...
[/OT]

[Juliet]

I was racing on [FM] Oval Junkles and it is a great server.:D Just that when i start some of my races the guy (or girl) in front of me barely moves or don't even hit the gas.:pillepall It annoys me when i have a chance for a top 3 and the guy (or girl) in front tries to wait untill everyone passes but they just make one of those pile ups that causes restarts.Y don't they go?:shrug:

It's very likely that I was one of those who did this yesterday.

First time on FO8, first time on Ovals but, and here's the problem, I use a keyboard and mouse ... so starts are either full throttle or very quick blips of throttle until the car gets going enough to short-shift through the gears. It's not that there's no throttle, just that it's either off or on, which isn't good in a rwd car iof any description ;)

If it was me, you'd also notice I apologised straight away and shift/s'd damn quickly.

When people do this (the bad starting) they might just be trying their damndest to get out of your way rather than trying to cause mayhem or get in your way on purpose.

[Becky Rose]

I've tried oval junkies previously and whilst online have been given two setups. In one of those setups I simply cannot start the car safely and did cause a few crashes at the start because of it, in the other I make reasonable starts (although sadly it's just not competetive at high speed).

I'm not into oval racing enough to work on my own setup, but I think newbies taking veteran oval racers setups is perhaps half of the problem at oval junkies.

If you've got a 'tentative' starting setup i'd advise against giving it out unless you recognise the other driver.

[colcob]

The hardest thing about the start in LFS is playing lag-chicken. Its very, very common for there to be a few tenths of lag before the car in front visibly starts moving. The first few times it happened, I slammed on the anchors or swerved violently, only to have the car appear half way down the road.
So now its a game of chicken when you start, because for a split second you dont know if the car in front isnt moving because of lag, or isnt moving at all, And by the time you realise its not moving at all, its too late to avoid it.

[spankmeyer]

How one can crash on oval circuit? I mean... it's basically a long straight with plenty of room and stuff. :shrug:

[Madman_CZ]

How one can crash on oval circuit? I mean... it's basically a long straight with plenty of room and stuff. :shrug:

pedal control my friend, pedal control. Some people are useless

[Jakg]

If you're drafting someone at the oval, you have to wonder why the hell are they braking at all :D

If you're at a circuit, if you're drafting someone you should always leave room for error. When I'm in someone's slipstream I always plan to brake before they do. Here's why: as most of us would know, when in a slipstream you catch up due to less wind resistance. If you start to brake while in someone's slipstream, you still have less wind resistance so you won't slow down as fast as the guy in front of you - this is why so many rear-enders happen in LFS (and other online sims). People don't realise that you can't brake at the same point you usually do when you're drafting someone due to the extra momentum - your speedo/tacho may tell you you're only be going as fast as you usually do at that point of the track, but the lack of resistance means you're actually going faster (relatively). Also, braking a bit earlier than the guy you're chasing gives you a bit more time to set up your line and go for the pass. Try to brake early, pull out of the slipstream and use that extra momentum to slingshot in front of your opponent, but be aware of that extra momentum and don't overcook it...how many times have you seen someone just shoot by you with locked brakes after they've tried to outbrake you? And how many times have you laughed out loud at them as they put it into a wall and continued on your way? :D

On that topic, how many times have you been blamed for a wreck because the guy who hit you from behind left no room for error and then blamed you for braking early? Personally, too many to count. My thoughts on that are pretty simple: if someone's good enough a racer to catch you and draft you to try and pass, they should be good enough to pass safely. If they take you out, they only have themselves to blame. If they're as good as think they are, they should be able to carve through the field without wrecking people.no, i mean i have been behind him for a lap, and i know wher ehe brakes, this particulkar incident was at BL1, he braked at hust past 175 for Castrol corner, i was just coming out of the slipstream (pulling out to overtake) and was going quite a bit faster, and yes i know i have to brake early, but as he braked so early, it put me sideways and of the track, all he said was "Dont ram me n00b!", but over time i have experienced worse, like people blocking on straights (well, not blocking, but swerving from one side of the track to another at 100 Mph, and of course, usually they spin) or when you are drafting, and they just brake on the straight to stop you passing!

Back on topic!

One thing i do find is that on the oval, very few people look to the side, like on the start finish straight, with the kink, i am on the outside, there is a car about 3 car lenghts behind me, two drivers bumpdrafting catch his draft and slingshot past him at about 200 Mph, then they get beside me at the kink, so now there are three drivers side by side, and the one in the middle doesn't see me (or more precisely, doesnt look!) and hit me into the wall, then, they recover, but i am left sideways with broken suspension, and the car behind me will have to take evasiv action. And geuss who everybody blames? Me!

[Becky Rose]

In the last month of playing LFS quite heavily I have only looked twice when somebody was on my side.

I use pit spotter... Don't be put off by people not looking :). Of course, that doesn't mean it wont end in tears.

[PLAYLIFE]

i feel your pain rappa. last time i was racing on a server i started something like 3rd and the guy didnt move infront of me so i ended up smashing into him even though i tried to avoid him/her....

but theres nothing u can do about that, mostly i think its the way lfs restarts races. People often pop to the toilet or to grab a drink,food or whatever and then suddenly everyone decideds to restart and they dont make it back in time with lfs giving you only 4 seconds to start a race......

but what can you do.... just shrug your shoulders and keep going

No, no! if u go to toilet u must go to spectate!!

[Rappa Z]

spectate or ban

[RedStarArmy]

just my 2 cents here...on the topic of AFKs..maybe the restart system can be changed around..somehting like a counter at restart shows how many seconds/minutes a person has been idle..or even at restart..you have to click "ready" your self before you are put into the race..just a thought.. :thumb:

[Madman_CZ]

just my 2 cents here...on the topic of AFKs..maybe the restart system can be changed around..somehting like a counter at restart shows how many seconds/minutes a person has been idle..or even at restart..you have to click "ready" your self before you are put into the race..just a thought.. :thumb:

i like that, thats how it kind of works in ghost recon or was it rainbow six :scratchch cant remember right now but in those games before every round starts u have to click ready in order to start the game. This however wouldnt for lfs work as the game wont actually start untill everyone is ready but there is a time limit on how long you can play around with settings.. then your forced to start the round.

But in lfs as suggested above clicking ready will put you into the game and if not into the pits :)

camon Scawen where are yooooooouuuuuuuu ? :D

mad

[Rappa Z]

i think they did havethat for like a week in [FM]. It was called camping on the track. even in the pits after like 20 seconds u were pulled off.

[mrodgers]

In the last month of playing LFS quite heavily I have only looked twice when somebody was on my side.

I use pit spotter... Don't be put off by people not looking :). Of course, that doesn't mean it wont end in tears.
LOL, I use pitspotter as well. I think I look to the sides MORE than I look ahead. At least in the GTi at Blackwood in demo (where I was hanging out for the last month or 2).

[Gabkicks]

sometimes right before dangerous corners (chicanes at blackwood and aston etc...) i'll look over to the car next to me and if the guy doesnt look back over sometimes i get nervous.:schwitz:

[DR3W]

All i have to say on this one is you got to work your foot!
When you fill it starting to spin tyers pump gas 2 times then back to full ect.. thats what i do it works pretty well for me, only problum i realy have is keeping a good line and staying on it evry lap, and staying with the grop cus ones you lose the grop your almost helples, there all up there drafting pulling awhwy...

[mrodgers]

sometimes right before dangerous corners (chicanes at blackwood and aston etc...) i'll look over to the car next to me and if the guy doesnt look back over sometimes i get nervous.:schwitz:
There's nothing more satisfying than looking over at a car next to you and making "eye contact" with him :thumb: .

[ste_]

The hardest thing about the start in LFS is playing lag-chicken. Its very, very common for there to be a few tenths of lag before the car in front visibly starts moving. The first few times it happened, I slammed on the anchors or swerved violently, only to have the car appear half way down the road.

So now its a game of chicken when you start, because for a split second you dont know if the car in front isnt moving because of lag, or isnt moving at all, And by the time you realise its not moving at all, its too late to avoid it.So very, very true. And also, so very, very anoying.