Default setting for "Haze effect"

[Scawen]

Just something incidental while I'm coding other things and before I forget about it...

I'd like to find out how many computers still have a problem with "Haze effect". When it was first implemented, certain graphics drivers had a bug which causes the nearby track to go all white or striped, basically WRONG! It is an unmistakeable bug in Cockpit View and even more so in Wheels View.

So... at the moment, when LFS runs for the first time, it chooses the setting depending on which video card you have. But I'd like to make it ON by default in all cases. So that's why I need to find out how many people still get the problem.

To answer the poll, please go into Options... Graphics and make sure the setting at the bottom of the screen "Haze effect" is switched to YES. Then drive along 100 metres or so in cockpit view and same again in wheels view. Then make your vote! :)

If you do get the problem, please tell us your graphics card and if you can find out easily, which version of the drivers you are using.

[Don]

no problem here - ati radeon 9800pro

EDIT:didnt see the poll before

[axus]

No problem here:

GeForce 5200 FX.

[NotAnIllusion]

No probs with
Card :nV GF 5200 FX
Drivers: NGO Optimised Forceware v84.12

[AndroidXP]

NVidia 6600GT, no problems.
(Drivers: ForceWare 81.95)

[Bean0]

No problems here, ATI X800, 6.3 Cats

[axus]

Wonder what is being updated about graphics though... :scratchch or is it just a simplified menu system?
Let the speculation begin...

[SamH]

No problems here.. except that I can't SEE the haze. I don't know why not, unless it's exceedingly subtle. I just don't see it, on or off.

XFX nVidia 6600GT w/latest nVidia drivers.

[eraser_svk]

works fine, sapphire radeon 9600xt with catalysts 6.1

[mr_x]

256mb ATI Radeon 9800XT - no problems at all

[PerG]

No probe nVidia GF FX 5200 128MB

[PLAYLIFE]

OK!!

Club 3D Radeon 9600 Pro

Never understod what the haze effect does...:shrug:

[Jakg]

Fine here, ATi 9600xt.ditto!

[csimpok]

Its OK here (GF 6600GT), but somehow I prefer it to be off... All I can see it blurs far objects and makes colors a bit "colder" i think. (?)

[tristancliffe]

100% fine here - Ati 9600Pro 256MB

[speedykev]

No problems
GeForce 6800 GT

[Scawen]

No problems here.. except that I can't SEE the haze. I don't know why not, unless it's exceedingly subtle. I just don't see it, on or off.It is subtle. It gives some depth to the graphics, even without being very noticeable. To see it, try looking at some distant buildings at South City - compare with it on and off.

[sgt.flippy]

ATI Radeon 9200 series, no problem.

*edited - removed can't see difference*

[woodbine]

OK - StLab Radeon 9200 128 MB 128 bit, Omega 2.6.75a. And please don't laugh at my card. :shy: Btw before I read this, I didn't know there is any haze effect in LFS. :D

[sgt.flippy]

OK - StLab Radeon 9200 128 MB 128 bit, Omega 2.6.75a. And please don't laugh at my card. :shy: Btw before I read this, I didn't know there is any haze effect in LFS. :D

Why laugh, it works better than my geforce FX5200 (except for the usual drawbacks that ATI brings you :shy:, or is it a completely different Radeon 9200? The StLab? Don't really know)

[Chaos]

no probs with nvidia fx5600, 128mb, detonator 66.93

[XRRoy]

working fine on a AOpen nVidia GeForce 6800 LE:)

[woodbine]

Why laugh, it works better than my geforce FX5200 (except for the usual drawbacks that ATI brings you :shy:, or is it a completely different Radeon 9200? The StLab? Don't really know) Why laugh? Because nowadays it is only an exhibit for technical museum. But it still works quite good. Yes, "normal" R9200.

Scawen, sry for OT.

[Jeddix]

No Problem.

Radeon 9800 Pro @ Catalyst 5.11

[Vykos69]

fine here x850xt, 256mb, ati catalyst 6.3
fireGL pcix 256mb, ati catalyst 6.3

runs fine on both, no probs there.

[_rod_]

No probs for me.

Fx 5200 256mb

Lastest nvidia drivers

[Pablo.CZ]

OK! NVIDIA GeForce 6800 GS

But please, make some buttons for pre-defined graphics settings (Weak PC / Mid PC / Powerful PC) or button for benchmark -> measure fps -> set graphics. I have many friends which dont understand all these sliders and options. They have very powerful PCs and "ugly" LFS, because of low default graphics settings.

[Becky Rose]

I have no 'problems' with haze, but i'm not sure what it actually changed when I enabled it.

SLi : BFG 7800GT 256mb X2

I do have one annoying issue with the graphics though - my PC runs at 60% throttle to play LFS but cars in the near corners of my screen have octagonal wheels, i've dragged the LOD sliders right up - i'd like to disable the LOD effect completely.

[Ball Bearing Turbo]

@becky: nice setup

Fine here, GeForce FX5900, forceware 81.xx (newest)

[Renku]

No corruption here; A9600XT (Cat 6.1)

[filur]

cars in the near corners of my screen have octagonal wheels, i've dragged the LOD sliders right up - i'd like to disable the LOD effect completely.

"Simple wheels" in Graphics section?, "Screen width affects LOD" ?

Regarding topic, everything's fine on my radeon 9550, but i really can't see the difference, comparison screenshots anyone ? :)

[Jeddix]

I have no 'problems' with haze, but i'm not sure what it actually changed when I enabled it.

SLi : BFG 7800GT 256mb X2

I do have one annoying issue with the graphics though - my PC runs at 60% throttle to play LFS but cars in the near corners of my screen have octagonal wheels, i've dragged the LOD sliders right up - i'd like to disable the LOD effect completely.

Try changing the "Screen width affects LOD"-option to "Yes" and the simple wheels should be gone.

[rediske]

no probs on wheels view...

GF6800 128MB

P4 3.2

[mrodgers]

Sheesh, does no one else have simple onboard graphics except me? I'll pipe in with the new onboard ATI xpress 200 that so many storebought PC's seem to have. No problems here.

[Pablo.CZ]

Try changing the "Screen width affects LOD"-option to "Yes" and the simple wheels should be gone.
Really? In that case this is "bug". If I have LOD set to max, why wheels are octagonal and why some option (Screen width affects LOD) can make LOD "bigger" than 1?

[schofei]

No problems here
Card : GeForce4 MX 460
Driver: 6.14.10.4523
DirectX: 9c

[DratsaB]

Fine here

7800GS 81.98 x64

[MataGyula]

Everything's cool :smileypul
Sapphire AtiRadeon 9600XT + Omega drivers / older version /

[Don]

for some ppl who dont see the difference, best is to check it on south city:

[sil3ntwar]

from what i remember haze drops my fps quite a bit so i always leave it off. but it looked fine on fx5200.

[sgt.flippy]

When I look at those two pics, I like the one without haze a lot better. With the haze on, the city in the background looks like it's glued on.

[JohnPenn]

No problems, and I much prefer it switched on.

6800GT

John

[Pablo.CZ]

When I look at those two pics, I like the one without haze a lot better. With the haze on, the city in the background looks like it's glued on.
problem with comparing these pics is different FOV, but i agree, haze efect is too intensive, could be depressed to 1/2

[KiDCoDEa]

Just something incidental while I'm coding other things and before I forget about it...

I'd like to find out how many computers still have a problem with "Haze effect". When it was first implemented, certain graphics drivers had a bug which causes the nearby track to go all white or striped, basically WRONG! It is an unmistakeable bug in Cockpit View and even more so in Wheels View.

So... at the moment, when LFS runs for the first time, it chooses the setting depending on which video card you have. But I'd like to make it ON by default in all cases. So that's why I need to find out how many people still get the problem.

To answer the poll, please go into Options... Graphics and make sure the setting at the bottom of the screen "Haze effect" is switched to YES. Then drive along 100 metres or so in cockpit view and same again in wheels view. Then make your vote! :)

If you do get the problem, please tell us your graphics card and if you can find out easily, which version of the drivers you are using.

from what i recall what caused those "car on white section" probs was FOG.
haze was a "safe downgrade" from that, which from what i recall never gave any extreme probs?
the only graphical glitch i sometimes still see is the shadow missing at some tv angles/distances (mostly on ati 9600 laptop).

[SamH]

It is subtle. It gives some depth to the graphics, even without being very noticeable. To see it, try looking at some distant buildings at South City - compare with it on and off.

I did as you said, and now I know exactly what to look for, I see that it was always there. It does make the buildings look like an overexposed photo, rather than contributing to the perception of depth, IMO.

If the haze effect is going to have any value, to me, I think it would be nice to bring it "inside the world", so that there is a haze looking down the long straight at Blackwood, for example, which disappears gradually as you approach it. That'd be a really nice application of the haze feature, I think.

[Takumi_Project.d]

If the haze effect is going to have any value, to me, I think it would be nice to bring it "inside the world", so that there is a haze looking down the long straight at Blackwood, for example, which disappears gradually as you approach it. That'd be a really nice application of the haze feature, I think.

thats the thing, it is! :) if you go down blackwood's back straight in forward config, soon as you can see the 4 tall buildings off in the distance, then stop the car. turn on and off the haze affect and you'll see the 4 buildings change. so yeah the haze is inside the world so to speak, and does disappear as you go down the straight, the buildings arent covered in haze when you get down the other end :)

IMO scawen has got it almost spot on, certainly for the clear weather setting. i wouldnt want to see it any stronger as it would look a bit unrealistic and remind me of the "fogging" technique some old N64 games would use, where the scenery would appear out of the distant fog :razz:

[B2B@300]

I do have one annoying issue with the graphics though - my PC runs at 60% throttle to play LFS but cars in the near corners of my screen have octagonal wheels, i've dragged the LOD sliders right up - i'd like to disable the LOD effect completely.

Under Graphics options make sure "Simple wheels" is set to off or mirror and under Misc options check your settings for multiplayer speed up particularly "dynamic LOD reduction" setting (0.00 is best, 1.00 is max dynamic LOD reduction)

@ SamH in real life if you look into the distance you can see a slight bluring or washing out of distant objects (5-20km away) that is what the haze affect is replicating, its not trying too create fog and or smog :D

[shim]

all is fine, but when lookin down main straight on BW, it doesnt seem no where as clear with haze on for me..

[mrodgers]

Wow, for so long, I've been looking at hexagonal wheels. I can't believe my wheels and tires are now round. Amazing!

On topic: Oops, I didn't even realize this was a poll. I forgot to vote. I'm looking at options now to vote.

Sheesh, and I didn't even see the "in wheels view" part. Man, what is with me?

[MadCatX]

Another PC that seems to be OK...:thumb:

GF6600GT, 83.90....

[Oxygene]

Radeon 9700 - no problems

[speedfreak227]

no problems

nvidia 4200ti (not sure of drivers but they were updated less than 6 months ago)

speedfreak227

[ORION]

9700 mobility 64MB
6800GT 256MB

both fine with any drivers so far. Note that I didnt try the latest 6.x drivers for the notebook (9700 mobility)

[BlackMan]

No problem here too
Ati Radeon 9550 128mb :)

[SamH]

thats the thing, it is! :) if you go down blackwood's back straight in forward config, soon as you can see the 4 tall buildings off in the distance, then stop the car. turn on and off the haze affect and you'll see the 4 buildings change. so yeah the haze is inside the world so to speak, and does disappear as you go down the straight, the buildings arent covered in haze when you get down the other end :)

IMO scawen has got it almost spot on, certainly for the clear weather setting. i wouldnt want to see it any stronger as it would look a bit unrealistic and remind me of the "fogging" technique some old N64 games would use, where the scenery would appear out of the distant fog :razz:

Yep, I see it and I agree. It rarely gets so humid in the UK that the haze would obscure anything much closer. I think it's just about spot on.

[kamo2000]

no probs.. ati x700 pro 128 mb cat 6.2

[sgt.flippy]

Problem is, in the dutch version, it translates the haze as "mist", what actually means fog, so I was expecting fog in the distance, or at least a lot closer than it actually is, that's probably why I never saw a difference.

[GianniC]

No problems, tho I drive with haze off -> for not getting my fps lower as it is now :shrug:

[GianniC]

Problem is, in the dutch version, it translates the haze as "mist", what actually means fog,

Isn't it more something like "smog", smoke, CO2 from the cars, when it's sunny you see it also more in distance,... ?
Cause fog is more when it's just rainy, cold, somewhere in the winter term no?!

[sgt.flippy]

Isn't it more something like "smog", smoke, CO2 from the cars, when it's sunny you see it also more in distance,... ?
Cause fog is more when it's just rainy, cold, somewhere in the winter term no?!

Yea, I know, I haven't fired up LFS for a few days now (have been playing the new driver), and I can't tell exactly how it's translated. It says: mist, in my opinion that means fog, like in the circumstances you describe. If it's smog... the translation should say "smog" :D A good translation for haze, could be "waas" or something. Doesn't really matter, now I know what it is, the translation is just confusing. I was expecting something like someone said, like the N64 fog. I would get fog in a distance, that blurrs out the track and objects a bit, but apparently it does that, but very far away so you can't notice all the time.

Little notice, who ever posted about a problem with this haze effect seems to be missing, cause there is still nobody that has problems with it.

[Rtsbasic]

No problems here - Radeon 9600, latest ATI drivers.

[STROBE]

while I'm coding other things
Grr, stop being so mysterious. :p

Turns out I always had haze switched off - I don't recall ever changing it myself so LFS presumably automatically turned it off for my card. Switched it on, no problems for me.

The haze effect looks good at Blackwood (as mentioned previously in this thread) with distant objects like the four towers becoming clearer as you get closer. But at places like South City it doesn't look right imho - with haze turned on it makes the distance/horizon look a lot more like a 2D backdrop than with it turned off.

gfx card: GeForce 5900LX (Asus), 78.01 drivers

Isn't it more something like "smog", smoke, CO2 from the cars, when it's sunny you see it also more in distance,... ?
Dunno, I'm no geography expert. But you can certainly have hazy days in the countryside or the coast where it's not pollution. I'm guessing it's something to do with the water vapour content of the air.

[96 GTS]

Works fine for me.
Radeon 9550 256MB with the latest drivers

[Blackout]

Hmm... I wonder why everyone are posting "all ok" and the card they are using. Cant you read? :razz:

If you do get the problem, please tell us your graphics card and if you can find out easily, which version of the drivers you are using.

[sgt.flippy]

Well, seems nobody has the problem so far, so everybody thought, let's post our graphics cards anyways :)

[GianniC]

Show offs ! :D

But Blackout, in my 1st post, I did it as Scawen asked, didn't I ? :smileypul :p

[96 GTS]

Hmm... I wonder why everyone are posting "all ok" and the card they are using. Cant you read? :razz:
It's a geek's way of showing off the size of their "masculine parts"

[sgt.flippy]

Weird, I just went along with the rest :D

*OT: didn't know you had to wait 1 minute between posting*

[Gener_AL (UK)]

no problems
7800GT (84.21 WHQL)

[three_jump]

no problems
ATI 9600xt (Catalyst 5.9)

[Vain]

No problems with 9800 XXL (technically identical with 9800 XT, different cooler and frequencies, is recognized as 9800XT by LFS).

Vain

[MyBoss]

No problems here, GeForce 6800 GT

[Warper]

Had been switched off over here too, don't know why. Works fine.

Geforce 6600 GT

EDIT: Driver version 77.30

[sturje]

No problem here, 84.21 drivers with a 6600GT.

[Gimpster]

No problems on a ATI 9600XT 256.

Driver: 8.221.0.0

[dave81983]

6600 GT no probs.

I think the easiest way to see the effect is to look down the blackwood straight and into the background, it looks a little foggy.

[Fordman]

FX5500 256mb AGP - Lastest Dets

No Problems Here, always On.

[ACE111]

Works Fine GF 6600gt with 81.98

[MadCatX]

Huh, youre bit late, m8:)

[skooby]

All ok for me. Radeon X1800XT Cat 6.3

skooby

[Scawen]

Thanks everyone.

Seeing as not one person reported any kind of problem, I have changed the code so in the next patch it will be enabled by default, no matter what card you have. :)

Coincidentally we have also just fixed a haze bug which made the track flicker when cars drove over it in the distance, so now we can enable the haze in the TV camera as well. So that looks a little nicer when there is distant scenery in the picture. It's only a minor effect but just helps in a small way with depth perception and realism.

Many more effects are planned for the future, of course... :)

[the_angry_angel]

:up: :D

[Bob Smith]

Super, great to know. TBH I'd never used the external cameras so hadn't noticed. :D

[ORION]

Coincidentally we have also just fixed a haze bug which made the track flicker when cars drove over it in the distance, ...
The one where complete track "segments" seemed to be too bright when a car was driving on them? Would be really cool if that was fixed :) Damn how I hate(d) this bug :D

Many more effects are planned for the future, of course...
I'd vote for lightmaps :smileypul

[DEVIL 007]

Thanks everyone.

Seeing as not one person reported any kind of problem, I have changed the code so in the next patch it will be enabled by default, no matter what card you have. :)

Coincidentally we have also just fixed a haze bug which made the track flicker when cars drove over it in the distance, so now we can enable the haze in the TV camera as well. So that looks a little nicer when there is distant scenery in the picture. It's only a minor effect but just helps in a small way with depth perception and realism.

Many more effects are planned for the future, of course... :)

Hi Scawen,

Run without issue on my graphic card as well.

I am really looking forward the new patch but would be also possible to fix that shadow "bug" with number of cars.It only display now max 8 shadows under the cars and I dont see reason why it cant display for example shadows under all cars.
Is this having some negative performance effect?If yes maybe it could be possible to a have slider for how many shadows under the cars are displayed?

Regarding the more effect planned I remeber you mentioned once in past that once most of the cards will have DX9 support that you might add some DX9 effects as well.Is that still in focus for soon future?I think the DX9 time is here.At least in my opinion.

Btw...I checked your baby photos so I would like to make a congratulation to you.Nice baby room as well.I know its quite late :shrug: but I have been quite a long time off the LFS scene being very busy in my current job.

Good luck...good life.