S2 FBM Series - General

[EQ Worry]

Hi everybody!

The AirAttack crew announces 2nd season of its FBM Racing Series and invites all decent people looking for some good and fair racing for fun with nice chatting before/after the event! 1st season took place only in demo configuration (that is on BL1) with one race a week for 45 laps (about one hour). Based on experience gained in organising the races the new season will bring many changes as they are summarised below:

1) Major change is moving to at least S1 tracks. If everyone seriously interested owns S2 licence, then of course also S2 tracks will be used - this will be decided on after 3rd race and some discussion.

2) There will not be one long race, but two shorter races. The two races will double the chance of some nice result for everybody. a) Each race would be run for 30 minutes plus one lap with short refreshment breaks after qualification end and 1st race end. b) First race starts in qualification order, the second in reverse order of the 1st race. c) One pitstop required in each race, probably with obligatory tyres change.

3) Dynamic point system will be used. Points given to winner will depend on the number of starting racers, spanning from 10 to 25. The meaning is to differentiate between finishing 1st (or 2nd, etc.) in a race with 6 people and in a race with 16 people. Also only certain number of total races with best results will be counted (say 12 of 16). This means players may safely miss some events without losing points/positions.

4) One car reset in each race will be allowed but for a penalty - stop and go plus 30 seconds. The intention here is to let everyone finish even when he/she topples his/her car or burns the clutch. The penalties will be given in sequence (first SG and then 30 seconds) automatically by the Airio tracker. This InSim application also takes care of 30 minutes + 1 lap race format, among lots of other things. To see it in action visit www.airattack.co.uk#1, www.airattack.co.uk#2 or [AA] AirAttack Racing servers.

So, these were the changes and basic not-so-common race format rules. Other rules concerning general behavior are ready and will be posted later, but nothing unexpected there. Anyway, your comments are welcome.

If you are interested and want to check the racing conditions and possibilities live, join a test race, last one before the season starts. This race takes place on the [AA] AirAttack Racing LFS server on Thursday, September 4th, 21:00 UK time (that is 20:00 UTC, I believe, 22:00 CET...). Done on FE2 with FBM it will be a bit shorter (2 x 20 minutes), but otherwise all the above mentioned rules apply. Note that car reset will be allowed and that server may not appear in list if the apropriate option is turned off.

That's about all concerning this announcing message and test race invitation. Other things like detailed rules, points and tracks will follow in several days. Also a system for signing up to race is being delevoped; test race is open for everybody who can join. And as already mentioned, your comments are welcome.

Catch you soon on track!

[mosseman(EST)]

I´d like to say YAY for that...1st season was great fun, cant wait for 2nd :thumb::thumb::thumb:

[EQ Worry]

As promised, here we have a "short" summary of the race rules:

A) Qualification

1) You can pit (Shift+P) as much as you want. Your best time stays valid even after pitting or spectating (Shift+S) and later rejoining (Shift+J), do not worry.

2) You can use any setup you want, it may be different from the race setup. You can have any amount of fuel (car weight) and tyre types you want. Most of these things cannot be checked anyway so it is better to leave them open.

3) Don't forget to join (Shift+J) the race before restart. Otherwise your qualification position will be lost and you will start from the back of the pack.

B) Race

1) You should drive and try to finish the race as long as your car is moveable. Do not leave the race just because your are one (or more) laps behind the leader or spinning constantly due to hot tyres. Press F12 (instructions to pit crew, you can also turn on/off repairs there), set required tyre types and drive to pits for exchange. Then continue in the race whatever your position.

2) You cannot use direct pitting during the race (that means no Shift+P). If your car is broken after an accident, try to drive slowly and safely to the pit positions for repairs. The other option is to use car reset and then carry out the S+G penalty in the same lap (!) with 30 seconds penalty following.

3) If you have used car reset already and your car is once more unmoveable (upside down, locked in gravel, with burned clutch), your only option is to spectate (Shift+S) and clear the track. You should spectate to the end of the race then. While spectating don't chat as it disturbs the remaining players.

4) Evade dangerous manouvers, drive fair. Judge for yourself whether it wouldn't be wise to let obviously faster players overtake you without much struggling. You are not forced by these rules to let them overtake you (unless you have blue flag, naturally!) but direct blocking or moving left and right is of course out of the question. You can however, if you decide so, keep the ideal line for yourself.

5) During a pit stop you must change all your tyres. This rule is here to prevent absurd stops with no work done. To be sure the tyres are changed, set Always as tyre wear level in car settings or F12 menu.

C) Finish

1) All players that complete at least 90 percent of the race laps will be treated as finished and can get points for their final position even though the game reports them as DNF.

2) Players with less laps will be disqualified and not included in final results, even though the game may have reported them as finished.

3) After the event race statistics will be published and results confirmed, points calculated. It is not possible to do this between the two races though.

D) General

1) If you say you will race and are added to the list, make every effort to be there at the right time.

2) If you are not on the list of participants, try to connect anyway and see if there's a free spot. But make no obstructions if the race is full already. You may very well spectate the whole race, because there are more slots available for this. Don't chat with others during the race though.

3) We are not lawyers here, so do not try to misuse the rules to your advantage. This is about their meaning and not exact words used. We drive for fun and enjoyment and the rules only set basic framework for that.

4) The race organiser has the right to do some corrective actions under special circumstances. He/she can for example decide to restart the race if something went wrong in the race starting stages (lap 1).

5) If you don't adhere to the above rules or behave otherwise in an unacceptable manner, you will be excluded from the next or all upcoming enduro events. But I don't expect anyone taking part regularly will have problems with this point. It is here just to close the rules nicely.

[wOoOzZy]

Great to have another series to race in =). Unfortunately, I'll probably miss the first few races cuz I'm moving on the 31st and I'm ordering a new laptop that will get there around the 11th, plus I'm not shipping up my wheel right away. But I look forward to getting in the running asap. :thumb:

[robybobey]

Hey guys, I'd like to take part in this, however I wont be able to make the practice on
September 4th (my birthday)...........I'm in California at the moment anyway and I will only be back on the 9th

See you soon!

[JakBot]

Sounds great! I would definitely like to take part!

Looking forward for the next Thursdays practice run :thumb:.

[3rdParty]

WOW Cool Stuff Worry and thanks for all the Work.

I've got work scheduled for the 4th but I'm looking forward to getting into some of these races for sure.

3rd

[EQ Worry]

Thanks people for all your responses. I see it is good to have one more test race - next week everyone will be ready. :)

I've been thinking about the points table - I already mentioned a sort of "dynamic" system will be used. I was looking for a system that could also be used on AirAttack demo servers for a sort of short-, mid- and long-run championship. It must meet the following criteria:

1) Points for the winner should depend on the number of participants.

2) It should support points for more than 8 first places.

3) The points for places must be progressive - the higher the position the higher the point difference.

Well, in the end I used a formula taking as input number of starting people and position in finish. Here's how the table looks like:

(the table was replaced, see below)

1) Winner gets (num_people * 15) points but maximum is 180.

2) Last to finish (if all starting really make it to the finish) gets 10 points (if not worse than 12th).

3) Other places get points according to the calculation, e.g. 67 points for 4th place in a race with 8 people on the start.

I know this system may not be as transparent as 10 - 8 - 6... one, but I believe it is much better. The high numbers (hundreds) are used to keep precision while evading decimal numbers.

Well, take a look, compare the numbers, write what is good/wrong, it is after all (for now) just a suggestion. :) It would be e.g. no problem to give points to 16 racers etc...

See you on the test race, everyone is welcome, give it a try!

[EQ Worry]

Oh, a little note. Feel absolutely free to invite other people that may be interested in the one test race or in the series!

The track is already prepared on [AA] AirAttack Racing for practicing. It is best to use the server name for direct connect because car reset is allowed...

[EQ Worry]

@ Silver : Great to hear from you again! And thanks for good-luck wishes. I hope to see you back fully online soon. :-)

@ everyone :

The test race proved to be quite interesting despite the fact that only 5 people qualified and just 4 did the two races (with the remaining one losing Internet connection completely at the worst possible moment).

FE2 is a tricky track with several spots where one can go fast (chicanes, turns) but also crash heavily. I think we all had major troubles and so the car reset feature with two consecutive penalties was checked and proved several times to be working correctly.

Race 1 results: Mosseman, Martini, EQWorry, (JakBot DNF)
Race 2 results: EQWorry, JakBot, Martini, Mosseman

With the final points table (giving 40 - 23 -13 - 6 points in this case) it means the following overall results:

1. EQWorry (13+40) = 53
2. Mosseman (40+6) = 46
3. Martini (23+13) = 36
4. JakBot (0+23) = 23

Mentioning the points table... I was never quite happy with the previous one. The new one (which I call final) is appended. You may notice the relatively simple formula used yet giving nice progression - points difference between top places is much higher than between the bottom ones, victory is most certainly worth fighting for from 2nd place, it may mean +30 points.

I missed only one thing there, more people to race with. I hope you all finish your movements/arrangements soon and join us. The season starts Thursday, September 11th, 2008, 21:00 UK time (that is 20:00 UTC) on [AA] AirAttack Racing server. Use the name to connect, it is the safest way. The track: BL1R, but this is still open to suggestions...

If you feel like trying it out, browse to http://racingteam.aa24.net/, click on Events, then FBM Racing banner and sign up for the race. This is not absolute necessity though, but it will be nice of you to give me an idea...

[JakBot]

Sounds wonderful!

Is it possible to set the server to practice mode say, hour or two before the race? Granted I could practice in SP, but it's so lonely :weeping:. :)

Looking forward for the season, keep up the good work Worry!

[EQ Worry]

Yes, the track will be ready there, probably all Thursday, at the latest in the afteroon... Everyone is welcome to drop by, do a few laps, later join the race...

[Trix wiv stix]

I hope I can make it, after talking to you Worry mate, I twisted my back and have been laid up for 2 days in bed. Better today but not racing fit :).

If i'm ok tommorow SEE YA THERE !!:thumb:

[EQ Worry]

Yeah, Trix, that usually happens to people that talk to me... :D

Get back into shape in time! Please... :)

[EQ Worry]

Thanks everyone for comming to the 1st event of new season! Eight people on start of both races is not bad, for the next week it would be nice to have 12... Everyone please note that it is not yet too late to join the season, because some of the events where you get the least points will not count - it means you can safely miss some evenings.

Detailed race statistics are online now. You can browse to http://racingteam.aa24.net page (official AA team site), click on Events, then on the Racing Series banner and finally on Statistics link. If you cannot be bothered with all that clicking, jump directly to http://racingteam.aa24.net/events/stats/fbm2/aa_frs_02_01ar.html and http://racingteam.aa24.net/events/stats/fbm2/aa_frs_02_01br.html...

Somewhere around the FBM event pages there'll be current points table - JoRuss is currentky working on that, big thanks to him for this and for preparing the whole AA site as well. I'll here just summarize current points:

1. Woozy (1st + 1st) -> 80 + 80 = 160
2. Martini (3rd + 3rd) -> 40 + 40 = 80
3. Mosseman (5th + 2nd) -> 21 + 55 = 76
4. JakBot (2nd + 6th) -> 55 + 15 = 70
5. Worry (4th + 4th) -> 30 + 30 = 60
6. JoRuss (6th + 5th) -> 15 + 21 = 36
7. Trix (7th + DSQ) -> 9 + 0 = 9
8. Mull (DNF + DNF) -> 0 + 0 = 0

Double win for Woozy despite the reverse start grid in the 2nd race - great beginning of the season and already a commanding lead!

Next races take place on [AA] AirAttack Racing server on Thursday 18th, 21:00 UK time (20:00 UTC) 1st race start. Qualification will start 15 to 30 minutes earlier, that is around 20:45 UK time. The track: SO5. Length: 25 minutes + 1 lap for each of the two races. I still could not contact some people that would surely be interested in racing - time to send new PMs to get the target number or racers...

[Neilser]

Hi...
Still finding my way around the forum ;-) and just came across this thread.

Is the race series still going?
Didn't see anything new on the team website (but maybe looking in wrong place).

[EQ Worry]

Yeah, series still going on, you'll certainly be welcome! Everyone interested may find complete race 2 stats and current standings here: http://racingteam.aa24.net/events/FBM/. You may notice it was a strange evening with only 6 people racing, some disqualifications, some pitting troubles. Still, nice double win for JakBot on SO5 track, cool achievement. Congrats!

I certainly do hope the next, 3rd race will see more people around. We're going to FE2, nice but very tricky track, as everyone doing the test race no doubt remembers.

Server: [AA] AirAttack Racing
Day: Thursday, September 25th, 21:00 UK time (20:00 UTC) 1st race start (qualification will start 15 to 30 minutes earlier, that is around 20:45 UK time)
Track: FE2
Length: 25 minutes + 1 lap for each of the two races

Everyone I can remember as showing interest will receive direct personal message - this will hopefully increase the number of racers.

Again, no previous notice is necessary, anyone can join the server for the qualification. The track will be ready there for testing on Thursday, just don't forget car reset will be allowed and activate appropriate option when listing available servers.

See you there! EQW

[wOoOzZy]

I'll be there if I can. My new job will most likely keep me from the race but I'll be there in spirit. Crash jakbot!!

[flano]

keen as mustard.:D

[13474072]

keen as mustard.:D [13474072] <flano. S2!

[Neilser]

Argh, can't connect - private host, needs password...?
Am I too late?

[EQ Worry]

Doh, such pity, you must have missed it by just a minute or two - the server was opened until the 1st race start, that was around 21:03 UK time. What a pity... Next time try to use "end" as a password...

[wOoOzZy]

Now I see what happened. I looked at the start time for the second race.

As for race 2.. I'm gonna just blame it on the fact that I was sick. Damaged for 2/3s of the race (my own fault) and wasn't able to put together a good lap in any of the other 1/3 of the race. And sorry again to Roby and Boost.

[Neilser]

Doh, such pity, you must have missed it by just a minute or two - the server was opened until the 1st race start, that was around 21:03 UK time. What a pity... Next time try to use "end" as a password...
Yeah, figured that must be what happened.
Got stuck late in work and missed the boat... Ah well!
Will practise hard for the next one :)
...
Hmm, just checked the date for the next race, will be out of the country until the night before so might still be able to compete, but has the track been decided yet? (Would be nice to practise a bit and I've only got experience of about three tracks so far...)

[Hyperdrive]

Is there a replay of round 3 guys? :)

Here (http://www.mediafire.com/file/k2hminfninu/AA FBM R3.rar) you go Silver. Good to see you out and about, but when do we get you back on the track?

[EQ Worry]

@ Silver - I have the replays, but can't upload them somewhere just now. I'll do that on Sunday evening or Monday and post a link here (or attachment). Ah, thanks Boost! :-)

@ Neil - It would be great to see you around. I have chosen AS3 as the track for round 4 of FM racing series. It would be our first visit to Aston and this track is not so complicated, I think. Maybe a bit lengthy for FBM, but we race for time and not laps anyway.

@ Everyone

I have compiled detailed table of all people so far taking part in the series, their races, positions, points gained for each position and total poins. It also shows the current standings. You find this table appended and its very short version is available on the racingteam.aa24.net site.

Also appended is the track plan for the season, finally compiled. It consists of 16 tracks, 3 of which we already did. If all goes well, it will end at the beginning of January 2009, just after a short winter holidays pause. You'll no doubt notice it is packed with S2 tracks. We waited for 3 races if someone S1-only capable appears, but as this is not the case, we go to the full possibilities.

I have tried to choose and combine tracks in a way that longer tracks are mixed with shorter ones and that there are always several different tracks before returning to an already visited racing site. I'm sure there'll be some tracks you won't be happy about (either long and boring or short and too hard in your view), but others may see just those as nice, so bear with it or skip that racing evening.

Races will be consolidated into groups of 4. For each player the racing evening with lowest points gained in a group will be ignored. People may thus skip some races, but still need to take part regularly. Real running positions will also be clearly stated after every group of races. Because the season consists of 16 races, there are 4 groups of races with one race in each group being ignored. After the 16th race we'll immediatelly know the winner, time for celebration!

The plan now is to have a short break, say one or two weeks, and then immediatelly start a new season, 3rd one. It will consists of the same tracks in the same order, but in reversed configuration. If all goes according to plan (that is a race EVERY week), then this part will be finished at the end of April or in May. Again, lowest score in every group of 4 races will be deleted. At the end we will have final results of the 3rd season.

If all goes well and the whole series idea would keep on living, we will altogether see 32 racing evenings, each with 2 races. I'll try to keep the series alive, inviting new people when I see some. Your help in this is most welcome, your regular attendance yet more. If I see the series is for some time getting hardly 6 racers, well, that will be the end of it. Plan to enhance the series: Ask Victor to move this thread and all other discussions into a separate folder. He requires the series to be running and to have an associated functional Web site. Thanks to JoRuss we now comply even with the 2nd condition. Then I'll look into possibilities to have a banner displayed in LFS Forum (but this may be automatic for every racing series).

Basically, we're prepared to accept more people, there is a framework for people enlisting themself to races prepared. Also prepared is a mailing list - you'll be probaly getting FBM racing series news and updates right in your mail. JoRuss spent a lot of time prepering the database acpects of the Web site, it is time to try the features up to their full capabilities. BTW, that framework is prepared for other racing series, be it Rally or GTR cars. So, if you have any plans in this respect, you may very well use what is already available. Direct your Airio features requests to me, Web/DB requests to JoRuss. :-)

And one more thing to open again, not for the first time. Day and time of he races. We discussed this several times, not reaching any conclusion. Some people were suggesting Sunday evening is much better but in practice it was a fiasco, clear one at that. Let me just repeat the main limitations: 1) Most players of the series are from Europe, so it must be evening European time, around 21:00 UK time. An hour before that is too soon for some, an hour later is too late for others. 2) For me personally Friday and Saturday evening is out of the question - I would miss half of the races in that case.

Still, if you'd like to take part in the series regularly and Thursday is really an awkward day for you, send me a personal message stating days/times when you can usually race. Come to think of it, it would be nice if I received such a "statement" from everyone already taking part. Maybe Thursday will do for you, but Monday is still better. Let me know, I'll try to compile a table. Example: "Every evening around 21:00 UK time with the exception of Friday, Saturday and Tuesday. I'm usually not able to race then. Sunday evening is best for me, but Thursday is also cool." I'll try to make sense of it all. :-)

Well, thanks for reading and taking part. See you all on Thursday on AS3. I'll be sending PMs again, it paid off the last time. Or there'll be the mailing list.

EQW

[EQ Worry]

One little explaining note to the current points table contained in my previous post: You may be surprised that Martini is on points in race 3/1 even though he did not conduct the S+G penalty (for car reset in last lap) correctly, and that Woozy has some points from race 2/1 even though he did not make a pitstop as required (because of race length confusion). The reason is this: To be on considered as finished, you must make at least 90 percent of the race laps (basically, you can lose 1 lap for each 10 laps of the winner, nothing more).

If you don't finish the race (e.g. because of fuel) or the game reports you as DSQ or DNF for some other reason, you may still be classified and get some points, but you really need the 90 percent of total race laps. Naturally, in these cases you are classified on a place after all that raced properly and finished the race as it is supposed to be done. That's why Martini gets reasonable points for 6th place in race 3/1. From the good racing perspective I see the 90 percent rule as more substantial than some technical troubles with penalties.

Also to give you some incentive to send me (via PM) the days when you are available I append here a table of ideal days. It includes only 2 players at present (thanks, Woozy, for prompt response :-), but hopefully it'll grow fast and we'll see if actually Sunday could be more suitable for the races. Be reasonable in the data you supply though, we may change the racing day once, but that's about it...

[Trix wiv stix]

:( cant make next thursday, first race anyhow. I'll be home about 21:30. Band have changed practice to thursday for next week. Not like I'm a contender for the crown anyway :). Just watched replay of 2nd race my car was screwed the replay looked like I had square wheels:), didn't feel too bad though.

see ya round and around and around.:thumb:

[MartiniOCP]

Hey guys! Great race we had last Thursday and I enjoyed it immensely despite some dumb moves on my side. Well not the first nor the last time that has happend. Anyhows, I took the liberty of recording and processing the last fbm event [+bits and pieces from other racing ocassions] and came up with a movie. Lame as it may be, it does present some quality moves we had on the track. Mind you all, this is my first approach to movie making and with very limited budget this time:D. Hopefully, you will enjoy the audio track. Looking forward to the next track wrestle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOGfVMArIpw

[EQ Worry]

@ Trix : Pity, try to come at least for race 2. It may start a bit later than 21:30 your time, but not by much... I hope you already know the password we'll use to make the server private...

@ Flano : Right, maybe you wont forget about the next race... :)

@ Martini : Nice one, I certainly enjoyed the video and the music as well! Good job, thanks for well spent 3 minutes.

Attached is updated "preffered racing day table", I'll be grateful for more entries, be it as simple as JakBot's or as thorough as Martini's. :) Note that the upcoming race 4 would take place on Thursday as originally planned. If there appear more entries favoring Sunday, it will be race 5 or 6 and the following...

Also, I have already asked Victor to create a subsection for our series (because it runs already and has its Web pages, the two main conditions), let's see what happens and when...

[Hyperdrive]

I’m afraid I’ll not be racing for round four of the series. An appointment has popped up that, try as I may, I just can’t sidestep. I’ll be back on the grid, working hard to play catch up, in round five.

[EQ Worry]

OK, thanks for information.

Just a short summary for all those who do not yet use the main AirAttack FBM Series pages (http://airattackracing.ovh.org/events/FBM/) and are interested in racing:

Track: AS3
Length: 25 minutes plus 1 lap
Date: Thursday, October 2nd, 2008
Qualification: 19:30 UTC (20:30 WET, 21:30 CET, ...)
Race 1: 20:00 UTC
Race 2: 20:30 UTC

See you there!

[EQ Worry]

With race 4 done we have concluded first group of the series races. Three more groups are before us, each with 4 races. Appended is a table of final group 1 results. For each player one race with the lowest score was ignored. It was one of the missed races for most people, only for me and JakBot there were really some points to be erased. You'll find full stats of all races at http://airattackracing.ovh.org/events/FBM/?p=stats.

From the number of people taking part perspective it was not a bad start into the new season. Still, I would hope to have at least 8 people on every race and 10 or more would make me happy. :-) As you probably know, I'm running a poll to select maybe a more suitable racing day. It looks like we have just two candidates - Thursday and Sunday, both 21:00 UK time. If you'd like to race but know for sure you can't do it on any of these days, let me know via PM. Appended is the current poll state.

Right. See you next Thursday on KY2. That's a nice track. I hope the people that could not race this week will be available for the next. We're starting a new group of races and we're still open to newcomers. Sure, they will start with zero points, but nothing is lost. And good races are always a thing to enjoy, be it for points or just for fun.

Oh, good news. As you may have noticed, Victor was so kind and created for this series a special subsection under the leagues node at http://www.lfsforum.net/forumdisplay.php?f=224 and that should be your primary source of information. Note that i summarized some information and put it into separate threads.

Generally, I would think this means we moved one step up on the virtual prestige ladder by this. Thanks to everyone who made this possible, all of you taking part in the series, and especially to JoRuss for creating the series (and AirAttack) Web pages including database/management interface!

[wOoOzZy]

woot =)

[EQ Worry]

Hi, there!

I come with some questions: In the AA FBM series we finished 4 races and it seems to me (and to other people as well) that some of the principles are too complicated and that they need adjustments. Basically three issues appear:

1) Season length and its stages. The season was supposed to be of 2 stages by 16 races each. Some people object that 16 is too many. (I wonder what they would say to my original ideas about season length - 32 to 40 events, every week until June. ;-)

2) Erasing the worst race results. There are some real racing series with e.g. two worst season results erased for each player. The advantage is that you can miss some races, disadvantage then that it's hard to calculate how many points you need in last races to move up to some position. Currently there is a relatively complicated scheme implemented - it groups races by 4 and deletes one worst of them. Because the season was supposed to contain 16 races, it would mean 4 your worsts races (approx. one each month) will be ignored.

3) Point system. Currently the points are calculated by a formula taking into account not only finish position, but also number of starting people. While this may be a very just system (preferring victory over many people and giving the winner points advantage as well), it is not really transparent enough.

I'd very much like to hear your opinions about these systems and possible changes which follow:

1) It looks reasoanble to have a season with 3 stages by 12 races each. Each stage will have one winner. There may also be an overall season winner declared, but that is still an open matter.

2) Either 2 of the 12 races in each stage could be ignored or every race will count. First option may be more comfortable for players, the second is very transparent. Even if we decide to ignore some races, the calculations just before the stage end may not be as complicated - if someone skipped an event, it is pretty obvious which result(s) will be ignored.

3) Alternative is to use the very simple and obvious point system - 10, 8, 6, etc. In every race first 8 players will get points regardless of the number of people on start. Everyone knows this system and it is the most transparent.

Right, that's all. I hope you won't be mad at me for changing some of the rules/plans in mid-stage, but some ideas that looked nice in theory don't go too well in reality. My current ideal would be to have 3 stages by 12 races and the simple, well known point system. I'm still not sure about ignoring some races, I'd rather say all should count. But I change my views quite often, as you are just experiencing. :-/

Well, your opinions about the above mentioned and other matters is most welcome. Take care and let me know. Note that once the changes are decided, there is no way back.

EQW

PS: Appended are two pictures, each showing two "would-be" tables. One picture shows tables with complex points and with one race igored/all counted. The other shows tables with simple points also with one race igored/all counted. Compare the tables. See how far ahead JakBot already is in the complex points, especially if no race is ignored. See also how close the points are in the simple system, which may not be as objective but allows for more close fights for points/overall positions. See also why I currently think no races should be ignored... :-)

PPS: Ehm, I appended one more table. This one uses the simple point system, but limits maximum number of points by people on start. It means that if less than 8 people race, the winner does not get full 10 points, but some lower value. When 7 people start, winner gets 8 points, with 6 people on start it is 6 points, with 5 people 5 points etc... I think this is still very transparent system solving a possible problem when in a race of three (I hope that never happens) the winner gets full 10 points just as if he defeated whole bunch of other players.

[Hyperdrive]

My vote is going to go for the more transparent system you’ve proposed, with all races being counted. Although I would have no major disagreement if we continued as we are, I actually like the format we’re currently running, I would prefer racers have a clearer idea of where they stand in the series.

Our race dates and times may need some revising though. I noticed wOoOzZy put in great effort to be with us for round three, but I don’t think we can expect that kind of commitment if we want to see more racers from across the pond competing. Moving races to the weekend, or mixing Thursdays and Sundays may be a fairer answer.

Other than that, thanks for all the work you’re sticking in EQW, you’re doing a fine job. :thumb:

[EQ Worry]

Right. From the responses gathered so far it looks most people would welcome the simpler, well known point system 10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1. After some discussion it also seems limiting maximum points by start grid size (in case less then 8 people race) is not a good idea for the series. (For current standings see the first appended table.) A bit more open is the matter of ignoring some races, say lowest 2 scores of the 12 races for everyone. Your opinion is still welcome.

Concerning the series day: The only available alternative (replacing Thursday) is Sunday evening. No one who responded so far to my "poll" (see the second appended table) reported troubles with Sunday (well, except Silver for whom it is Monday very, very early morning). Still, I'm not rushing for a day change. Last year it was supposed the rally races will have more people if taking part on Sunday and it was... well... a disaster. I'm still waiting for more responses confirming Sunday as the preferred day.

[robybobey]

Couldn't make the race at AS3, sorry about that, but I'll try and make all the others :D

[EQ Worry]

@ Roby: Sure, that happens. We'll be glad to see you on any of the following races.

@ Everyone: Same to you. :-)

Note that there are two separate threads for Rules and Announcements. Check them up occasionally. We have also a new thread about AA FBM Demo Racing Series, starting soon...

As already hinted, the points were changed to the simple 10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1 system. Winer always gets 10 points regardless of number of people on start. 2 worst of the 12 stage races will be probably ignored for everyone, but this has not been irrevocably decided yet...

[TeQ NL]

A bit late to join, but thanks for the invite, I'll be there sunday :)

[EQ Worry]

It is never too late to join some good (hopefully) or at least reasonable :-) races. And once we finish the first 12 races, another round is coming. Thanks for the response!

[3rdParty]

Looking forward to racing tomorrow. Is it the same time 21:30 for qualy and race at 22:00 UTC?

Thanks,
3rd

[EQ Worry]

Eh, took me some time to send the invitational messages and post the announcement, sorry. But the times you mention, 3rd, are not quite OK. It is 20:30 UTC for qual start and 21:00 UTC for race 1 start... See you there! :-)

[Roccivic]

Can I participate, too? Even if there are only 3 races to go. I already signed up on the AA website btw.

Rouslan

[EQ Worry]

Can I participate, too? Even if there are only 3 races to go. I already signed up on the AA website btw.

Of course! You'll be most welcome. 3 races to go in this stage, but then we move on to another one, altogether still lots of races to do. I'm sending notifications using the LFS forum, so check your messages there. I also post announcements here. Just FYI next track is SO1R, qual start on Sunday 16th, 20:30 UTC (also 20:30 in Ireland, I believe)... Also note that it is probable we'll be doing the following races on Thursdays, if that is not a problem for you.

[modelmotorracing]

I've put myself down to join, I've not done any league races before so I wanted to see how I get on with making sure I get all the domestic arrangements sorted out to be on-line at the appropriate time. I think Thursdays and Sundays from 8.30pm are usually both OK for me so it looks positive! :)

[EQ Worry]

I've put myself down to join, I've not done any league races before so I wanted to see how I get on with making sure I get all the domestic arrangements sorted out to be on-line at the appropriate time. I think Thursdays and Sundays from 8.30pm are usually both OK for me so it looks positive! :)

That is great, everyone will no doubt be happy to see you around! This series might be a good entering ground, I think, because we're not dead serious about who wins and such things. The whole point is to spend evening in a community of pleasant people, have a race or two to compare your capabilities and luck on a certain track... and that's it. :-)

[modelmotorracing]

Well that was fun, pleased to get a podium finish more by luck than judgment! 25 minutes certainly makes your arms and feet ache though, I should probably visit the gym sometime soon. :) Hope to be able to get along next week.

[Roccivic]

That was certainly fun, so I'll be back next week for more :)
The only thing I'm wondering is, what track is it going to be? EQ_Worry yesterday said KY3, but in the roaster it says FE1...

http://www.lfsforum.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=67941&d=1223541942

Rouslan

[modelmotorracing]

It says Kyoto on the AA web site. I'm rubbish at both so it makes little difference :)

[EQ Worry]

Very happy, guys, to see you around! The track will really be KY3, althought the first plan was to try FE1. But we had SO1 last week and there is AS2 coming next week, so separating them by sometning longer looked like a better option in the end.

KY3 is a track loved by many, known by a few. :-) Currently I cannot even remember if there's a left- or right-hand side turn coming next, much less how to take it. Well... It is ready on [AA] AirAttack Racing for testing, except Friday evening when the demo FBM series takes place.

Hope to see you there, whether you have the time to practice in advance or not!

[EQ Worry]

Hi, there!

After some time I come with updated tables of results. They show all the past events with people scoring points. If you do not find yourself in the table at an expected position, note that it is very probable you've been disqualified from that particular race.

Two most common causes for DSQ:

a) Insufficient total lap count, which must be at least 90 percent of laps done by the winner.

b) Forgetting one obligatory tyre change in each race, which makes pit stop times rather more realistic.

Take a look at the appended tables. The last table is incomplete, one evening (2 races) still to go.

One more note: After careful consideration it was decided there will be no races erased from peoples' scores. The first idea would be that 2 events (or 4 races) with the worst score will be deleted for each player, but it really makes things rather complicated both from racers' and administrators' perspective.

It means the tables are final in curent stage and points you need to get in the last race to move up the ladder are clear. Because there's maximum 20 points you may get in one evening, the first two places of this season stage are already set. It looks like a very nice battle for 3rd spot though with low differences between three or four players.

Take care, see you next week!

[3rdParty]

Thanks Worry.

Good Racing Sunday.

Is there any more word on going back to Thursday's or will it stay Sunday for a while?

3rd.

[EQ Worry]

Yes, it was some marvelous racing - all people shown nice driving skills, but as always some suffered bad luck, while others had good luck for once.

The last race will take place on Sunday. I'm not still quite sure whether a new season (or just a stage of the season) should begin immediatelly or if we'll do a short break. Also I'm still not absolutely sure about the Sunday/Thursday choice, because we've seen nice attendance the last race. These things will yet be decided, just keep on listening. :-)

Just a short reminder: You can find all stats on the AA team pages, specifically at http://airattackracing.ovh.org/events/FBM2/.

[modelmotorracing]

I enjoyed Sunday's races a lot and I hadn't raced that track since the LFS tutorial and never with anything other than AI cars so it was good from that point of view too. Sundays certainly seems to work fine for me at the moment. I looked through the results and dropping the worst meeting doesn't affect the scores as everyone missed at least one (using MIN(range) in Excel). We tried a similar system at another racing club I'm a member of, to prevent it becoming a championship of attendance rather than of racing skill. On the one hand it's a nice safety net if something unexpected happens and you can't attend. Or then again you can do what Jakbot did, win the title good and early to make sure you have a holiday! :)

What about a non-championship event in between seasons, with a different car, e.g. FOX.

[3rdParty]

"Or then again you can do what Jakbot did, win the title good and early to make sure you have a holiday!" Yeah that's Nice... Well done Jakbot!

Nice win in the second round Worry. Way to go man... Can somebody post the replay of that second race...Nick or Neil I think had it but I missed hitting the key.

I'm up for cranking back into a new series the first of the year and I have the following suggestions:

- We keep the server (generally) locked to the next race track (better for practice)
- Track changes are made early and are definitive with input from drivers and changes made as needed, but it gets done quick (say within 72 hours of the previous race finish)
- The dedicated server is open to all aspects of pre-race practice. Practice racing, qualifying or whatever should be free and good to go. I like logging in and seeing folks on the race circuit we will be using for the race.

That's it from me.

Great racing and very cool of you guys to let me join up with you in this series.

I'm new to this game but I'm full Admin in a UT2004 server. I manage the team speak and deal with server issues as needed but I'm burned out on 1st person shooters.
http://psychosnipers.com/
[PSI]3rdparty_check


Cheers,
3rd.

[modelmotorracing]

Here are the replays from the KY3 round on Sunday 23rd. Also the previous week's. I have my LFS set to save everything, so if I'm in it, or watching it, I've got it. Hmm, must clear out my hard drive soon... :eek: They are particularly useful for these races as there is usually lots of great action going on elsewhere on the track but always miles ahead of me :) so it's great to watch them back again with TV Director running, the next day. The CTRA servers save all their replays in an archive, does Airio not do the same?

KY3_race1.mpr (http://www.modelmotorracing.com/lfs/KY3_race1.mpr)
KY3_race2.mpr (http://www.modelmotorracing.com/lfs/KY3_race2.mpr)
SO1R_race1.mpr (http://www.modelmotorracing.com/lfs/SO1R_race1.mpr)
SO1R_race2.mpr (http://www.modelmotorracing.com/lfs/SO1R_race2.mpr)
Each one is about 3 to 4MB.

[Roccivic]

b) Forgetting one obligatory tyre change in each race, which makes pit stop times rather more realistic.

Oops, I didn't know that one. Oh well, I'm a rookie anyway.

Rouslan

[deiwisxxx]

http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?p=989860#post989860

There are some pictures of FBM racing
From now on after round I will fill this treat with pictures
PLZ look up :) :smileypul :thumb:

[deiwisxxx]

FBM demo pictures there in my treat take a look

[JakBot]

Hey, nice pictures deiwisxxx!

[deiwisxxx]

thnx jakbot

[Roccivic]

I had a nice time racing yesterday, although not everyone did, I guess, after that mega pile-up at T1 of the first lap of the second race.

What's the story with the new championship? If there'd be a vote whether to start right away or start in the new year, I'd vote to take a break for these 4 weeks. Although it would be nice to know what tracks are going to be used for the season right away.

Rouslan

[modelmotorracing]

Here are the replays:

AS2 Race 1 (http://www.modelmotorracing.com/lfs/AS2R_race1.mpr)

AS2 Race 2 (http://www.modelmotorracing.com/lfs/AS2R_race2.mpr)

Yes Turn 1 of Race 2 was interesting, shades of Spa 1997! A couple of guys up front got together and that was that. Worth keeping an eye out for that angry AD guy from qualy in future, he has past "form" on CTRA. Not my favourite track that, only three real corners and I can't drive any of them! :)
Hope to be able to get along to the races in the new season though.

[Roccivic]

Did many turn up for the test race on such a short notice?
Just wondering.....

[EQ Worry]

Yes, my bad, sorry for the very short notice. I wasn't sure until the last moment if there should be a race or not. Just six people made it in time, but only 5 races because I lost connection and was offline for full 50 minutes. From what I heard it was one shortened race (15 minutes) and one very short (5 minutes). I'll make sure the next test race is announced much sooner, several days before the event, not several hours. Meanwhile suggestions for track to race on are welcome. Options: FE2R, KY2R, AS1, FE3, WE1, KY3R, AS2. :-)

[Neilser]

Yes, my bad, sorry for the very short notice. I wasn't sure until the last moment if there should be a race or not. Just six people made it in time, but only 5 races because I lost connection and was offline for full 50 minutes. From what I heard it was one shortened race (15 minutes) and one very short (5 minutes). I'll make sure the next test race is announced much sooner, several days before the event, not several hours. Meanwhile suggestions for track to race on are welcome. Options: FE2R, KY2R, AS1, FE3, WE1, KY3R, AS2. :-)

Hehe. Yes indeed, a bit of a quiet evening. I think it was 5 of us that started the 15 minute race, but unfortunately we lost the leader (also to a connection problem I believe) about half-way in, and gained one more person mid-race :-)
The 5 lap race was quite close and more fun though! (Even though only four of us then...)

[Roccivic]

Yes, my bad, sorry for the very short notice. I wasn't sure until the last moment if there should be a race or not. Just six people made it in time, but only 5 races because I lost connection and was offline for full 50 minutes. From what I heard it was one shortened race (15 minutes) and one very short (5 minutes). I'll make sure the next test race is announced much sooner, several days before the event, not several hours. Meanwhile suggestions for track to race on are welcome. Options: FE2R, KY2R, AS1, FE3, WE1, KY3R, AS2. :-)

I vote for KY2R :)

[EQ Worry]

I vote for KY2R :)

Right, that's a valid choice. :-) Generally speaking, we've been recently on SO and AS and KY, maybe it is time for FE?

[Roccivic]

So when is the new season starting?

[modelmotorracing]

Well it wasn't last Sunday, turned up at 8.30 and "no drivers" :) - Presumably this week? I see you are now sporting [AA] in front of your name Rocci, I was thinking of doing likewise! I am now racing as "Deslotted" rather than under my "modelmotorracing" licence name which was too long I thought. For a while I tried "profscooter" which is a name I use on other forums (long story) but I then had people asking me what make and size my scooter was and of course I don't have one :rolleyes2: Deslotted refers to the fact that when not racing on LFS I am racing Scalextric cars, hence when on LFS I am "de-slotted"! :)

[EQ Worry]

Hi people! First: Model, that was a nice story about scooter. :) Well, I still do not get the meaning of Deslotted (maybe because I have no idea what Scalextric) is. My bad. :shrug:

Now about the season: Guys, I've devoted all past year to LFS, first racing, then mostly programming Airio (now downloadable, see http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=52368). This has got me into a situation when I cannot go on in this fashion any further.

By outer circumstances I'm forced to take a serious leave from LFS, several months at least, to get back into shape. I cannot do any more racing, organizing. I may drop in sometimes for a while, watch the servers a bit, but nothing steady, serious.

I will reserve some time to Airio bug fixes, if some are needed, and helping interested people to set up Airio on their servers, but that is the maximum I can do. I'm sorry for this, but I'll surely see you on track a bit later in 2009! Take care!

EQW (note my motto is not appended...) :tired:

[modelmotorracing]

Sorry to hear that EQ. I am also a bit out of shape but mainly down to too much Christmas food. I need to get back on the Wii Fit. :D Will another AA member be able to take over the organising do you think, or is it something only you can do?

PS Scalextric is a UK brand of slot car (www.scalextric.com (http://www.scalextric.com) is the web site).

[EQ Worry]

Ah, now I see clearly what Deslotted means! Thanks for the explanation. What is Wii Fit? Eh, just joking. :) We'll see about the series, I'll ask around...

[Neilser]

Hi Worry. Sorry to hear you have overindulged on LFS and have to take a break!
But many many thanks again for the time you put in organising the races and writing a superb Insim extension - Airio has lots of features I miss on other servers :) :clapclap:

[modelmotorracing]

Ditto. Happy to chip in and help where I can.

[5haz]

You certainly deserve a break Worry. :)

Jshaw. :thumb:

[3rdParty]

I don't know where other folks come from in this game because I'm still getting deeper into LFS and meeting people in the game. I look forward to growth, good races and a good race team in the future. The end of the year brought me a broken ankle which killed my driving immediately and I've been stressing on the AA season and how many races I can afford to miss. Sometimes real life kicks in (in various forms) and we need to deal with that first- as we should.

Worry I can’t thank you enough for your work with Airio. I have read the entire guide you wrote and was very impressed. Let me know if you want me to do some proofing, I suck but there are some simple grammatical changes that would make that doc better. The app itself seems brilliant to me.

I can’t thank you enough for putting together the last series. I’m sure you had help from other very qualified members and I regret not having the series admin list at my finger tips but you were the front man for me and the one that emailed and PM’d all the info prior to the races.

You took some shit at one race for not re-starting and I was very pleased to see a strong rally around your decision, which I fully agreed with, and I would love to see us build on the rules.

Please let me know if I can help out in anyway and thanks very much for all of your efforts on my behalf.

Sincerely,
John Fryer
3rdParty

[EQ Worry]

Eh, guys, thank you all for your concerns and very nice words.

John, sorry to hear about that ankle, but your words moved me deeply (I hope I get the expression right), no joking. Also, when I update the docs to version 2.0, I would be very happy to send you the files for some basic proofing. And that one race without restart: It made me feel real happy seeing so many of you defending me, especially because I also used wrong command at the time, restarting qualification just when it was ending.

Neil and John, I'm glad you like Airio. It should give admins many options, it should give players many choices. Airio is now my primary concern. When I announced it I had requests for features, some obvious, some a bit more complicated to add, some pending.

About the series: I think anyone of you may take the initiative and organize the races. I would give you names of people I was inviting and some instructions on how to set up the race. Currently it is nothing complicated, calling one or two Airio commands does all the work.

I found out that to have reasonable attendance, an active inviting approach is necessary. You have to look for new people (on AA1 and elsewhere), write PMs and direct invitations as well. That takes some time because you have to be online a lot to see new nice guys.

Publishing stats is also good but it requires some time. JoRuss has complete stat upload framework ready, which means you may run LFSstats on the replays and upload the generated files relatively easily. Internal scripts then take the results and convert it into point tables. It was working flawlessly for me, and I think JoRuss will have no great troubles giving you access there.

All in all, thanks to you all for support. It is not my intention to leave LFS world, I just need to limit the extra activities, at least for some time. Give me 8 to 12 weeks, I may be back at (almost) full strength by that time. :) Take care, see you soon!

PS: To help me a bit you could spread good words about Airio, maybe suggesting to admins on other servers to try it out. Also make people aware they may support Airio development by donating. That could make me return somehow sooner. :)

[ToxicKlay]

Is the championship still open?

I would like to join and race.

[JoRuss]

Yes.. probably... not necessarily fbm one though....

The following picture describes pretty good how we stand about this year races :D

picture (http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/8519/aaairattackracingp1.jpg)

[EQ Worry]

Anyone interested in the AirAttack racing series please check the following thread: http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=55879. Basically, we've moved to FOX, a car similar to FBM.