Fern bay cerbstones

[henrico-20-]

hi there,

this is probably asked before but i make a poll for it.

what do you all think about the cerbstones on the fern bay layouts? i think they are to high. especially at FE_green. it is just to much in the chicanes and turns. when u race for example a GTR car it is almost impossible to drive 10 laps without crashing or rolling over or going off the track.

so my sugestion is, would it be a good idea to lower the cerbstones on fern bay?

[Dajmin]

I always thought they were called "run-offs" because you're not actually supposed to use them as part of the track, they're just a last ditch effort if you run a little too wide. In that respect, they're fine as they are.

I think the problem is that people think they can just throw the cars over them without thinking about the consequences. Personally I don't think there's anything wrong with them.

[frokki]

I'd like to vote option number 3, that would be "make more of them". The last chicane exit in green&black for example needs one to stop people to use the grass stuff as their advantage.

They are part of fern bay, and removing them would make the track more boring and not fern bay anymore. I really don't want that :shrug:

[henrico-20-]

I always thought they were called "run-offs" because you're not actually supposed to use them as part of the track, they're just a last ditch effort if you run a little too wide. In that respect, they're fine as they are.

I think the problem is that people think they can just throw the cars over them without thinking about the consequences. Personally I don't think there's anything wrong with them.

i only know them as cerbstones! don't know all english terms.

I don't know if they are ment as run off's, because they are all on the inside of the turns. if it where runoff's they would probably be placed on the outside. with TBO cars or XFG/XRG/UF1 these thing are no problem at all. only with the faster cars, they roll over in no time. it is difficult to avoid cerbstones all the time. ecpecially when there are manny drivers online, all wanting to go first treu the corners.

[HVS5b]

I just hate FB full stop. Can be relatively competitive on the rest of the tracks but I just don't 'get' FB at all.

I say bin it altogether (:grumpy:) or make the chicanes proper chicanes that need to be taken in 2nd or 3rd gear.

[Boris Lozac]

I just hate FB full stop. Can be relatively competitive on the rest of the tracks but I just don't 'get' FB at all.

I say bin it altogether (:grumpy:) or make the chicanes proper chicanes that need to be taken in 2nd or 3rd gear.

+ 1

[Ian.H]

i only know them as cerbstones! don't know all english terms.

I don't know if they are ment as run off's, because they are all on the inside of the turns. if it where runoff's they would probably be placed on the outside. with TBO cars or XFG/XRG/UF1 these thing are no problem at all. only with the faster cars, they roll over in no time. it is difficult to avoid cerbstones all the time. ecpecially when there are manny drivers online, all wanting to go first treu the corners.


I'd suggest that "many of the drivers" in that case need to learn how to race and that sometimes, it's _you_ that has to back off.

FE's curbs are small in comparison to some ;)



Regards,

Ian

[NitroNitrous]

I love FB as it´s now :lovies3d:

[Forbin]

@Ian.H: The difference there is the curb is on the inside of a nice wide sweeper, whereas FE has them in tight corners (one after going under the bridge at FE Gold/Black) and in chicanes that are shallow enough to be straight-lined.

That said, I think it gives FE part of its character.

[Ian.H]

@Ian.H: The difference there is the curb is on the inside of a nice wide sweeper, whereas FE has them in tight corners (one after going under the bridge at FE Gold/Black) and in chicanes that are shallow enough to be straight-lined.

That said, I think it gives FE part of its character.

Are we both talking about the same thing Forbin? :)

I thought the OP was "complaining" about the curbs being too high and causing issues when people drive over them, hence the pic I attached.

Got a stinking headache atm, so I might have misinterpreted :)



Regards,

Ian

[Alkanphel]

Many times I've ruined a good race by driving over the high curbs at a normal speed, and the XFG just rolled over. Could be quite frustrating. :(

EDIT: The 90-degree turn 2 on FeClub Rev is one of 'em.

[Boris Lozac]

Either we have a proper suspension damage, or flatten the curbs, this is completely unrealistic and really bad to watch... :shrug:

[Stefani24]

big -1
it was always fun to ride over these and to flip.

[Alkanphel]

big -1
it was always fun to ride over these and to flip.
In the middle of a race and you're in the top three? Not so.

[Forbin]

Are we both talking about the same thing Forbin?

I thought the OP was "complaining" about the curbs being too high and causing issues when people drive over them, hence the pic I attached.

Got a stinking headache atm, so I might have misinterpreted


Regards,

Ian
I'm talking more about the placement of the curbs in relation to their size. In the 'Ring pic you posted, a driver is unlikely to ride over that curb on the inside due to the nature of that corner. On the other hand, a driver is very likely to ride over the curb in a shallow chicane.

[March Hare]

If you roll your car in a race you are not going to get a podium finish. Simple. It's very easy to roll the car after the chicane in BL1R too.

I like those high cerbs. Makes it more important to keep the round black things on the black/gray stuff.

That pic by Ian, isn't that the Nürngerburger ring? Wouldn't it be interesting to compare those who want it in LFS to those who complain about the cerbs in Fern Bay...

[Alric]

Fantastic as they are. Each track is different and has its own lines and character. Such as stated above at the nurburgring. Most of the curbs at the ring you avoid except maybe a handful that you can get away with and gain time. :)

So big -1

[The Radness]

I have been rolled plenty of times becuse of those curbs:(. But it is part of the track and I eaither have to deal with it, or not race there.

Lately it seems CTRA1 has been doing FEGreenREV(?) quite alot. Just horrible really. Too long for the low power cars IMO:shrug:.

[NitroNitrous]

Many times I've ruined a good race by driving over the high curbs at a normal speed, and the XFG just rolled over. Could be quite frustrating. :(....

That´s the good thing, you have to be carefull, you have to be a good racer, you have to do the driving :nod:

Maybe you prefer NFS :shrug:

[ajp71]

@Ian.H: The difference there is the curb is on the inside of a nice wide sweeper, whereas FE has them in tight corners (one after going under the bridge at FE Gold/Black) and in chicanes that are shallow enough to be straight-lined.

That said, I think it gives FE part of its character.

The curbs are part of the track, and whether you can ride them or not should depend on the curbs, not the track layout. IRL you don't approach a corner and decide to run over the curbs based on the fact it's a tight corner/shallow chicane, you must weigh up the chance of the cars being upset or damaged by the curbs if you run over them.

[Forbin]

Agreed, ajp. Although, with the way things are right now in LFS, you don't suffer much (if any) damage from jumping the FE curbs, and it's possible to set the car up to not get too upset by them.

[Kristjan.J]

They were alot lower in the S1, if you watch the movies... :scratchch

[Vain]

Normally I'd support changing the layout of the track to not make the cerbstones too rediculous. The Fe Green and Gold chicanes are simply stupid at any competitive pace.

However I have the feeling that detachable car parts are within the scope of LFS by now and I assume that the possibility to rip off your front wing will put some constraint to jumping the FE cerbs.

So my opinion is: If anything needs to be done it's work on the car damage model rather than work on the cerbs.

Vain

[duke_toaster]

However I have the feeling that detachable car parts are within the scope of LFS by now and I assume that the possibility to rip off your front wing will put some constraint to jumping the FE cerbs.

Rumour has it that some changes to the graphics engine that may be able to facilitate it may happen soon, but not in Patch Z.

[word.]

And until we get proper aero modelling, people will just make the cars ride ridiculously high to get around that :(

[wsinda]

My main gripe is the curbs in the chicanes. IRL taking them would damage your car, but in LFS you can take them full-throttle and gain lots of time (at the risk of taking out half the field).

Making them higher is not a good option, because FE would become too much of a stop-and-go track. Lowering the curbs is a possibility. But I prefer a change in the damage model so that you can take the curbs at most once or twice (otherwise you blow a tyre, bend the suspension, or lose a wing).

I have no problems with the curb height at the inside of turns (e.g. the 90 degree righthander in FE Club). Most of them can topple your car, which is at it should be.

[Vain]

Rumour has it that some changes to the graphics engine that may be able to facilitate it may happen soon, but not in Patch Z.Rumour has it that you're talking rubbish. :tilt:
(just joking :) )

Sorry, but your post really needs some sort of source.

Vain

[Boris Lozac]

Rumour has it that some changes to the graphics engine that may be able to facilitate it may happen soon, but not in Patch Z.

Maybe in Xmas 2009? after the Arctic and Antarctic language support... :tilt: just kidding offcourse .. ;)

[Rappa Z]

I like them the wa they are. They add some real difficulty to the track.-1

The first thing I think of when i say Fern Bay is pot and high curbs.:D

[tristancliffe]

Kerbs are NOT part of the track in real life. The track is defined as 'within the white lines', and kerbs are invariably outside of them.

Technically you are not meant to routinely use any kerb, even at the professional level. This rule is never tested in professional racing, but is occasionally in club racing (people being DQ'd for excess use of kerbs).

They are allowed to be used as an escape route - a bit more 'tarmac' to avoid an accident.

At the Nurburgring the kerbs are high even in a lot of places where you might want to use them. At the old Abbey kink at Silverstone the kerbs are about 6" high, with a 45° ramp angle - you don't want to use them!

So FB's kerbs are just fine, and a lot of LFS's kerbs are too forgiving.

[ajp71]

Rumour has it that some changes to the graphics engine that may be able to facilitate it may happen soon, but not in Patch Z.

Sounds like somebodies bullshitting to me. Any source of this (or even evidence of said rumors)?

[hyntty]

Kerbs are NOT part of the track in real life. The track is defined as 'within the white lines', and kerbs are invariably outside of them.

Technically you are not meant to routinely use any kerb, even at the professional level. This rule is never tested in professional racing, but is occasionally in club racing (people being DQ'd for excess use of kerbs).

They are allowed to be used as an escape route - a bit more 'tarmac' to avoid an accident.


This is true, but it's the racing driver's nature to find the shortest possible way round the track. It would be absurd to punish a driver for driving as fast as he can. If there were no curbs drivers would still use the shortest route, and thus cut the track.

Additionally, although we can't test it in LFS, the cerbs are extremely slippery in rain, so that's one more reason to take corners carefully. I guess cerbs are one of the things that you're driving skills are measured with. The braver you use them, taking more risks, the faster you go.

[tristancliffe]

Only up to a point. If there were no kerbs then people might cut them a bit, but risk an accident as one tyre loses grip on the grass.

Drivers don't find the shortest route, because then they wouldn't go round chicanes, but across them, flat out. Remove the kerbs and people will stay more within the white lines. Kerbs are really there to a) give a bit of room for error and b) reduce the costs of having to re-grass the insides of corners. They are not there to make the tracks faster.

Kerbs can be slippery in the rain, but some aren't. The bravery is finding out which are which. In a road car kerbs are pretty much as grippy as the track. In an F1 car the difference is enough to class them as 'slippery'.

[Zen321]

I guess Fern Bay's kerbs are quite fine the way they are.
They add to the diversity of the track, which is fine.
Fern Bay might be a slow track, but it is hard to master, with it's sharp curves, sudden elevation changes in corner, plus the high curves are part of this difficulty.

We can say that kerbs got two functions:
- The outside kerbs are a last resort or a way to gain more tarmac when entering and exiting, and their role is to put you back on the tarmac, for their lowest spot touches the track, it implies that it will reduce your bodyroll and cancel the understeering you are under.
- The inside kerbs are a way to prevent people from cutting through the corners. Indeed, when you take them too sharp, your bodyroll will increase, increasing your understeer and make you go back on track.

The one at Fern Bay are raised in order really to prevent you from your cutting options, but once you know pretty well your car and the effect of these high curves, with an appropriate entry and speed you can use unique lines in order to pass your opponent, even if the risk of rolling is around 50% or more depending on the car.
So take them like an investment : you decide to use a risky stuff which can make you crash, but that will also turn you faster... Few risk = few return on investment.

[HVS5b]

Maybe in Xmas 2009? after the Arctic and Antarctic language support... :tilt: just kidding offcourse .. ;)

Don't be ridiculous.....I heard from some bloke in the pub that Urdu and the Click language of the San Bushmen are next for development ;)

So Eskimos have 147 different words for "snow" (urban myth, I know :tilt:). I wonder how many they have for "noob" lol

No offence Devs, luvin the Y18 patch :thumb: