Round 5 Penalties and Results

[hyntty]

Here are the results from Free Practise 4 attached. (If there were fp 1-3....) Didn't bother to write them down.

[Technique]

During the yellow flag, two cars spun out, i passed them, then they passed me.

During the restart, approximately 5-6 cars could not hold the SC pace so I passed them. They were about 50 car lengths or more behind the rest of the field.

[mutt107]

NBÏ ÐàràÌÍÿ - passed me under yellow at the start of the oval part b4 green...

and i am sry for passing over the bumps...

[Stefani24]

yep that was my 1st problem too, but then i ran out of ******* fuel
DAMNIT

[dougie-lampkin]

When the Green Flag RCM was displayed, 3 or 4 cars passed me...it was made very clear after R3 that you cannot pass until the start line...this was at the turn before the oval...

Also, at lap 6(?), 2 turns before the oval, I was passing Konata-San on the inside, and he just turned into me, forcing me off the track...

I'd like these 2 incidents investigated please...

[J@tko]

Lap 2, NBR bds punted me off the road before the fast chicane with the bumps in the middle of them

Under SC, oh dear. No-one seemed to remember that you are not allowed to repass cars that overtook you after you span. Criminals:
FinnWest
Yuni_GTR.

Maybe more :shrug:

[dougie-lampkin]

Under SC, oh dear. No-one seemed to remember that you are not allowed to repass cars that overtook you after you span. Criminals:
FinnWest
Yuni_GTR.

Maybe more :shrug:

Add Kuptius (or similar, I had names off) to that list..

[FinnWest]

'No-one seemed to remember that you are not allowed to repass cars that overtook you after you span. Criminals:
FinnWest
Yuni_GTR.

Maybe more :shrug:

When did this rule change? I didn't know that. in previous races it was allowed. If this has been discussed somewhere here then I'm sorry I have missed it

[Technique]

When the Green Flag RCM was displayed, 3 or 4 cars passed me...it was made very clear after R3 that you cannot pass until the start line...this was at the turn before the oval...

Also, at lap 6(?), 2 turns before the oval, I was passing Konata-San on the inside, and he just turned into me, forcing me off the track...

I'd like these 2 incidents investigated please...

I passed you and everyone else because you guys would not hold SC pace. Everyone was WAY behind the rest of the field. Once the green was displayed you guys were still going at a slow pace. As far as I'm concerned, I did what I had to do to stay part of the race. I have no idea what Captain Slow was doing (oops got u TG guys mixed up!) :)

[kABLiuks]

1. Kanata-San bumped me under SC and i span and lost one place

2. I dont know waht happend in lap 10 with Hintty, i watched replay and donno, it seems that i was on my racing line and he tried to cut...

[JO53PHS]

Sorry that I crashed into Rescue Car 2 at the end of lap 3 (That was the very moment that my screen went black for no apparent reason)

My complaint: Stefan Alphons crashed into me under the safety car and made me spin. Having done this, Stefan Alphons went and PARKED BANG SMACK IN FRONT of my car, and then stood there for a good 3 or 4 seconds.

Everyone was WAY behind the rest of the field. Once the green was displayed you guys were still going at a slow pace. As far as I'm concerned, I did what I had to do to stay part of the race. I have no idea what Captain Slow was doing (oops got u TG guys mixed up!) :)

The reason we were way behind is because of the incident mentioned above. The reason I was going slow is because my clutch had half burned out, and I wanted to get it cool again. I did say several times 'EVERYONE PASS ME'

[GTR_Yuni]

1. Kanata-San bumped me under SC and i span and lost one place

I let you regain your position.

[Stan]

Few incidents to mention.

Lap 4, start of SC period, Stefan overtook me.

Lap 5 as already mentioned, FinnWest went past me under SC.

End of Lap 5, still under SC, there was contact between Rob and myself which resulted in me spinning off. I was ahead of Rob under SC, so I think I am entitled to have some space either side of me. ie. you should be behind the car ahead of you under SC conditions, not alongside it.

Sorry to all drivers concerned for bringing these up.

[hyntty]

2. I dont know waht happend in lap 10 with Hintty, i watched replay and donno, it seems that i was on my racing line and he tried to cut...

Again, I'm sorry for that. It's all because of the bloody oval. I thought there would be enough room for you, but because the track curves it's surprizingly difficult to estimate how much room the other car needs. My fault, totally.

[Stan]

Joseph, I didnt want to pass you under SC, even with you saying 'Pass me' as it would appear to be an illegal move.

If you (or your clutch) were too damaged to maintain the SC pace, you could have pulled off the circuit so people could pass you legally.

Not making an issue out of it, just saying.

[dougie-lampkin]

End of Lap 5, still under SC, there was contact between Rob and myself which resulted in me spinning off. I was ahead of Rob under SC, so I think I am entitled to have some space either side of me. ie. you should be behind the car ahead of you under SC conditions, not alongside it.

Sorry to all drivers concerned for bringing these up.

Sorry about that, those behind me were right up against me, and my rear was damaged enough as it was, so I sped up slightly. Then they sped up and you slowed down a bit, and I clipped you.

As for passing under the SC, I wasn't going race pace because Captain Slow was going erm...slow in front of me, and I knew I wasn't allowed pass him. Those behind shouldn't have passed, SC pace is technically like 60km/h, which we were going faster than...

[JO53PHS]

Joseph, I didnt want to pass you under SC, even with you saying 'Pass me' as it would appear to be an illegal move.

If you (or your clutch) were too damaged to maintain the SC pace, you could have pulled off the circuit so people could pass you legally.

Not making an issue out of it, just saying.

In that situation, me saying 'Pass me' would probably have made it ok to pass, but Its good you stayed on the safe side.

I tried not to hold you up as best I could :shy:

[Stan]

No worries Dougie, it was quite messy back there during the SC, no hard feelings.

[dougie-lampkin]

Cheers :shy:

[Technique]

Here's the restart. Notice it's green flag and look how far we are behind the rest of the field. I hadn't passed anyone before that point under yellow (even though no one could keep pace). Both kipsus and nightmare spun during yellow and then passed me. Captain slow should have been off of the racing line if he could not keep up with the field. Rob, when it went green I stayed behind for as long as possible. Once I realized you were never going to pass joseph I passed you.

[dougie-lampkin]

Here's the restart. Notice it's green flag and look how far we are behind the rest of the field. I hadn't passed anyone before that point under yellow (even though no one could keep pace). Both kipsus and nightmare spun during yellow and then passed me. Captain slow should have been off of the racing line if he could not keep up with the field. Rob, when it went green I stayed behind for as long as possible. Once I realized you were never going to pass joseph I passed you.

Yes, but I didn't pass because you're not allowed to pass unnder SC...He said "pass me" after everyone else had gone...

I know it was green flag, but we hadn't crossed the line, and technically we can't pass him, right??

[evilpimp]

Can someone upload the replay plz I wanna see how it was, also who was on the podium?

[J@tko]

Can someone upload the replay plz
Either me or Deko will tomorrow.

who was on the podium?

haha :D me :D

(yes - everyone else crashed!)

Unofficial results attached.

[evilpimp]

:O Grats my fellow alien :P

And to you aswell Jack n Mutt!

I knew u'd do good jack your laptime in practice was pretty nice.

Now jus gotta wait for the replay n see how it went.

[J@tko]

:O Grats my fellow alien :P

And to you aswell Jack n Mutt!

I knew u'd do good jack your laptime in practice was pretty nice.

Now jus gotta wait for the replay n see how it went.
http://new-dimension-racing.bravehost.com/Round%205,%20Race%201.7z

[TAYLOR-MANIA]

Interesting average speeds! :really:
Positions 1-8 match in pairs...is that a bug or is that actually correct?

[J@tko]

Interesting average speeds! :really:
Positions 1-8 match in pairs...is that a bug or is that actually correct?

Hadn't noticed that :D

Yes, it's a bug.

[mutt107]

:O Grats my fellow alien :P

And to you aswell Jack n Mutt!

I knew u'd do good jack your laptime in practice was pretty nice.

Now jus gotta wait for the replay n see how it went. :D :D

[evilpimp]

http://new-dimension-racing.bravehost.com/Round%205,%20Race%201.7z


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I get this error :S

[Technique]

Yes, but I didn't pass because you're not allowed to pass unnder SC...He said "pass me" after everyone else had gone...

I know it was green flag, but we hadn't crossed the line, and technically we can't pass him, right??

I know you were trying to follow the rules, which is good, but the rule says:

"1. If the car ahead of you spins or is otherwise unable to maintain safety car speed, that car may be overtaken"

If that wasn't in the rules, then someone can simply drive 10mph around the course and hold up everyone! :)

[kipsus]

I seriously think there should be strict regulations about SC period. Something like 5 pos penalty for each bump (unable to maintain safe distance during SAFETY car) and of course in case of an accident immediate disqualification

[dekojester]

So everyone knows, I will be going through all the complaints in this thread tonight.

Make sure that they are in this thread if you want them checked into.

d

[dekojester]

I have split off the extraneous discussion of the Stefan and JO53PHS incident.

This thread is unlocked. Any further chat of that incident will be removed, no questions asked.

I will be going through the replays starting in about an hour or so.

d

[pacesetter]

I thought it was really unfair that my internet broke and i spent all my time this evening trying to fix it for the lfs beginners cup....despite all this i had to start in the pits and by the time i was out of them all the cars were a country mile ahead! there was no point of me being there and if this happens to someone else who takes time out of there sunday evening i think you should let them start from the back of the grid...........:(:(:(:mad:


Pacesetter

[dougie-lampkin]

The incident with Konata-San that I would like looked at, actually happened in Lap 1. I don't know why I thought of lap 6 :shrug:

EDIT: I've watched the replay properly now, and I can't see anything wrong with what I was doing under SC. In the second corner of SC, I bumped in Kipsus when the field braked sharply. Due to the low ride height of the FOX, I couldn't see anyone ahead of him, so I wasn't expecting him to brake sharply. No damage was caused, and we resumed pace.

The incident where Garally stopped was a complete disaster. He just stopped right in front of Captain Slow, with no apparent reason. If his clutch was damaged as he says, I'm sure it would have lasted until the pack resumed again, and then he could have safely pulled onto the grass. I did run into the back of Kipsus quite sharply here, but everyone had similar incidents. He stopped and pulled over with Technique, so I kept going. I would deem that as him losing his position, as it isn't directly my fault that he pulled over. At the next turn, the Race Control told Stefan to give the place back to Captain Slow. But no-one else was mentioned, so I take that to mean that that was the only illegal move.

Kipsus then tried re-taking his lost positions, and I didn't want to let him in (No hard feelings or anything, it's just that I liked my position :)). So I stayed about a car length from Stan in front of me, which I deemed to be a safe distance at 60mph. He was about the same distance away from Captain Slow in front of him.

Captain Slow then started saying "Pass Me", even though he was passing out other cars, so I got confused here! It was here that I clipped Stan (So sorry mate!). Other cars then started passing us out, even though we were doing 80mph, well over SC limit. So then I passed him too...I think, looking back on it, that if he wanted everyone to pass him, he should have pulled onto the grass...

My weaving didn't cause any incidents at all, contrary to reports...


That's my views on the race anyway, there were some problems I thought...


EDIT2: There wasn't much noticeable chat, the only culprit really being DalekSam throughout the event...

[dekojester]

I dont know waht happend in lap 10 with Hintty, i watched replay and donno, it seems that i was on my racing line and he tried to cut...

From my end, this incident appears to have been caused by some network latency. Neither made any uncalledfor moves to block/change lanes.

This is being declared a Lag-induced incident.

d

[dekojester]

This post addresses all incidents during the Safety Car Period.

The following drivers overtook during the safety car period and will be assesed a 5 second time penalty per car overtaken.

Format: Drivername (cars overtaken) [Total penalty]

FinnWest (6) [30s]
NBr Garally (1) [5s]
Stefan Alfons (2) [10s]

The schemozzle on the SCs in lap was due to NBr BDr going very slowly through Turns 2 through 5. A 4-point penalty will be assesed to him.

Everyone else in that schemozzle is recieving a WARNING for not paying attention to what's going on ahead, following too close, and not driving cautiously during an SC period.

d

[dekojester]

NBr BDr is being placed on Probation for the rest of the season for his incidents in Round 5. He will start at the back of the grid for round 6, both races, for causing two avoidable incidents, the first during the SC period, and the second, on the lap where he spun and tried to rejoin into oncoming traffic.

d

[dekojester]

Also, at lap 6(?), 2 turns before the oval, I was passing Konata-San on the inside, and he just turned into me, forcing me off the track...


This incident took me a good hour to decide on this.

One could contest that Rob had sufficient overlap enterting the turn, therefore
meaning that konata-san had to leave him racing room.

One could also contest that Rob did not have sufficient overlap until after the standard turn-in point, and Rob did not exercise due caution when making the maneuver. Rob could have waited, and used the slipstream to overtake konata on the oval bit.

So, in short, I am going to give both drivers a CAUTION based on the points made.

A stricter penalty is unwarranted because Rob finished and konata DNFed.

d

[dekojester]

Attached here are the results.

Results will become official at 2200 GMT on 4 March 2008.

d

[JO53PHS]

This post addresses all incidents during the Safety Car Period.

The following drivers overtook during the safety car period and will be assesed a 5 second time penalty per car overtaken.

Format: Drivername (cars overtaken) [Total penalty]

FinnWest (6) [30s]
NBr Garally (1) [5s]
Stefan Alfons (2) [10s]

The schemozzle on the SCs in lap was due to NBr BDr going very slowly through Turns 2 through 5. A 4-point penalty will be assesed to him.

Everyone else in that schemozzle is recieving a WARNING for not paying attention to what's going on ahead, following too close, and not driving cautiously during an SC period.

d

Two questions/statements

1) Was I involved in this so called schemozzle? If so, I DID pay attention to what was going on ahead, and I DID just about brake in time :D. Just to let you know I am not appealing my warning, If you can even appeal a warning :scratchch

2) Whats a schemozzle ? :D

BTW dekojester, you just managed to Quint-post /Penta-post yourself :)

[dougie-lampkin]

Well, I was looking ahead, but with the combination of the poor visibility out of the FOX, a terrible connection and LOD turned all the way down, it was hard to see ahead...and it was just after the apex of the corner, so I couldn't really see it...I'm sure this applies to others too...

Nevertheless, a good decision for the circumstances...:shrug:


As for the incident between me and Konata-San, I thought I had the rights to the racing line, as I was ahead going in to the apex. What's the ruling on this (the rights to racing line)? I know that the single seater's are notoriously difficult to see sidewards, but shouldn't he be aware of the surrounding environment? I drive with vitual mirrors on to make sure I can see what's happening around me clearly...

The general ruling was, with my understanding, that in Single Seaters, the driver who's head is further ahead has the rights to the racing line, and the other driver, whether they be on the inside or outside, must give way.

I respect your decision Deko, and I'm not appealing the ruling, I'm just wondering...

Also regarding the penalty for bumping another driver, what about lag? When someone brakes sharply, there will probably be a delay between them braking and it showing up on everyone elses PC. Should the person who brakes like that be penalised instead?