when do you think the next big patch will be released?

[michaelnyden]

and what do you think will be the major changes?

graphics
physics
mutiplayer
tracks
cars
other/misc?

[Tweaker]

For next major patch... I'd think in the next 2 months.... anything beyond that is just TOO LONG of a wait!!

And I think it won't fix everything in one go, but probably most of the common issues, physics fixes specifically. At least I hope so....

And who knows when S2 final will be done, hopefully months after improvements. If they can have it done before Spring ends, then that'd be pleasing.

[B2B@300]

My guess is (and it is only a guess :D ) that within the next 2 months we will see some compatible patches (i.e. no physics changes) and then in the 3 months or longer time frame we will see a major physics update :shrug: I base this on what little I have read of the complexities of tyre physics and that is a very complex subject :schwitz:

Ps we might see an earlier physics update if it is dealing with the aero only :scratchch but thats my guess, lets see who gets the closest :D

[deggis]

I'm happy if S2 Final comes before Christmas... 2006.

[alexoxol]

I think it will be released not earlier than netKar PRO will be released.. ;)

[LRB_Aly]

I think next incompatible patch will have some physics update (speeding issue with higher rides in front than rear i.e.), and perhaps some multiplayer fixes.

[xaotik]

In my crystal ball I foresee the coming of a physics update and cockpits for the race cars.
Alas, I have to take the ball to the shop because it won't give a time estimate...

[deggis]

I think it will be released not earlier than netKar PRO will be released.. ;)
or Racing Legends :D

[colcob]

God, sometime soon I hope. I dont think anybody imagined that some language support was going to take such a long time.

The only problem with doing everything yourself is that that includes all the tedious scutwork like painstainingly debugging multi character support for weeks on end.

[Qurpiz]

I think during next 2 months.
I guess there will be many (physic) bugs fixed, and maybe some new features too. I don't think we'll get new cars/tracks sooner than S2 Final, and even then I only think we'll get some new configurations.

[nikimere]

xmas 05

[sinbad]

Must say that in all honesty I'm disappointed that we have not had a major update yet.
Mainly because I could not believe it if someone told me that (if the alpha had not been released early) we would not have a full and improved "final" S2 by now.

[tristancliffe]

My personal feeling is that we should have any patch, compatible or not, whenever they are ready whilst we are in Alpha stage. I think it's quite clear than alpha means non-finished, and implies the improvments will be forthcoming.

However, from the devs point of view, they are trying to make LFS a real product, and as such don't want to continually release patches which beginners to LFS might find disorientatiing (i.e. suddenly finding that there is no one online, or no servers exist, and not knowing why). So, I can see why they want to save up fixes and improvements to one big update.

It's a difficult situation. The big LFS fans want it to progress, the beginners want it to progress, but might not be active enough to realise an update has been released or how to install it, and the devs don't want to distrupt the game. At the end of the day it's the devs project, so their wishes I guess come first.

[Liquid Li0n]

Update the car it self a lot. The damage model is still alpha. They have to work still a lot on it.
Then the lights and moving hands that go off the steering wheel. (gearbox, horn, handbrake)
Then The weather with working wipers and day/night mode
New cars or tracks aren't necessary. Just add some details to the existing cars.

[W1LLSD4D]

Anybody said

"When it's ready"

yet? :D

[Hyperactive]

To be honest it's little annoying that I have bought a game and there is no info about next patches or when the S2 alpha goes to S2 "full".

[ORION]

Anybody said

"When it's ready"

yet? :D
"When it's done" would be the correct answer :smileypul :D

[AndroidXP]

Right with Duke Nukem Forever.

Why ok, that's a bit too pessimistic

[Tweaker]

To be honest it's little annoying that I have bought a game and there is no info about next patches or when the S2 alpha goes to S2 "full".
Sometimes it is announced in a progress report on their website... but progress reports are hardly needed at the moment because S2 has been released... only it needs little improvements to be finalized. This has been said by Scawen in various places of the forum... you just have to kind of put them all together to get a patch report. And there has been a recent thread about current patching and upgrades to this game... but they are just language feature updates... nothing special compared to what people really want... but that is the most recent thread to stay updated on what is going on at the moment.

[the_angry_angel]

Right with Duke Nukem Forever. Only 311 days , according to gameplay (http://shop.gameplay.co.uk/webstore/productpage.asp?productcode=RM9139&title=duke_nukem_forever) at the moment :D

There is hope! :razz: But seriously, who knows when we'll get a patch, and what it'll contain; we've been very lucky during these recent 0.5P patches as we know whats coming in them before they arrive, or have a really good hint of what they might contain, what with the increased level of "news" from Scawen. In general I usually try and steer clear of these threads, but I've just gotta say that Tristan is completely and utterly right on this one.

[STROBE]

Sometimes it is announced in a progress report on their website... but progress reports are hardly needed at the moment because S2 has been released... only it needs little improvements to be finalized. This has been said by Scawen in various places of the forum... you just have to kind of put them all together to get a patch report. And there has been a recent thread about current patching and upgrades to this game... but they are just language feature updates... nothing special compared to what people really want... but that is the most recent thread to stay updated on what is going on at the moment.
I think what Hyper was meaning was the lack of information about slightly longer term stuff than weekly language patches, because I feel the same way. Don't get me wrong, I fully support LFS, the devs, and the way it's being made. It's great that the money goes to the devs rather than it being siphoned off by a lazy & greedy publishing corporation, and even in alpha phase it's still by far the best racing game imo. I haven't played any game this much in ages (apart from one quiet weekend in, when I blitzed GTA:SA to get it finished. :p). But there are times when I wonder "when" and "what"?

Obviously Scawen doesn't want to say too much because it can either start spreading rumours which then become interpreted as fact (eg. Scawen says "I'm starting work on aero and physics in December", which eventually becomes "Scawen said the aero and physics will be all done in December!"), or people could leave out of boredom and not come back for a while if he admits that it's going to be months.

But despite all that, I'm sure that just some idea from the guys themselves of precisely what's on Scawen/Eric/Victors "to do" lists and the order in which they'll be tackled would go a long way to calming the occasional doubts that myself and others may have regarding the progress of S2. :thumb:

[cannonfodder]

It's a difficult situation. The big LFS fans want it to progress, the beginners want it to progress, but might not be active enough to realise an update has been released or how to install it, and the devs don't want to distrupt the game. At the end of the day it's the devs project, so their wishes I guess come first.
I think what's really needed is a way for the client to get a message from the master server when going online if there's a new patch out. Then inform the user in an annoying popup that the current version is out of date before displaying the atrophied server list. Or better yet, an autoupdate function(that would probably eat too much bandwidth though).

[Hyperactive]

What I mean is that there hasn't been any info ...about anything really. I know that they are working hard to make LFs better all the time (or actually I don't, but i presume and hope :)). The latest info in www.liveforspeed.net is about the P2 patch, which was released months ago.

What annoys me is that I have no clue what are they going to upgrade in next patch. The P12 at the moment is mostly about language and stuff and I have nothing against it. It's a good patch, thank you. But only thing I know that is going to be fixed is the high nose aero bug. And even that was just mentioned by Scawen in one other thread...So I don't want to take it too seriously :) But that's basically all I am expecting to be changed in S2 full.

It would reduce the whining about the known problems if there is something said somewhere if they are at least investigating it.

Are we going to get S2 beta before going full? I am not asking when it will be done, I just want some info what are the areas they want enhance next. The odd thing is that we don't know if the amount of cars and tracks are going to change. What am I playing at the moment? S1 with some physics upgrades and car and track addons? Or the core of LFS S2 with some things just needing some polishing and fine tuning?

I really hate complaining but it seems I am just doing that at the moment.:shrug:

[Bob Smith]

I should have asked Scawen at the meet what his objectives were between now and full S2 release. He seems less willing to divulge information when he's not cornered by fans in the pub. :p

Although on the plus side, we do know everything that is happening at the moment, with test patches being so regular.

[Keith Carter]

To be honest, I haven't played LFS in over a month after learning of the high nose exploit. I pretty much exclusively drive the FOX and I was banging my head against the wall trying to find time on certain tracks. I enjoy applying real world racing physics to my car to make it handle better. It has happened in other sims that I have raced that once someone comes up with an uber-unrealistic setup that is extremely fast that I lose interest FAST. Cars with -15 degrees camber up front should not work (another sim).... Setups shouldn't work when you have weight/ridehight jacked so far to the back that you'd actually be slower down the straights and have so much weight on the rear that you'd push right off the track. I hope a patch is released soon to keep the fantasy car setups away. I realize it takes time and I absolutely love what has been developed so far. It's the best sim I've played yet. I just am hoping for something soon so LFS will stay ahold of my relatively short attention span.

[Hyperactive]

To be honest, I haven't played LFS in over a month after learning of the high nose exploit. I pretty much exclusively drive the FOX and I was banging my head against the wall trying to find time on certain tracks. I enjoy applying real world racing physics to my car to make it handle better. It has happened in other sims that I have raced that once someone comes up with an uber-unrealistic setup that is extremely fast that I lose interest FAST. Cars with -15 degrees camber up front should not work (another sim).... Setups shouldn't work when you have weight/ridehight jacked so far to the back that you'd actually be slower down the straights and have so much weight on the rear that you'd push right off the track. I hope a patch is released soon to keep the fantasy car setups away. I realize it takes time and I absolutely love what has been developed so far. It's the best sim I've played yet. I just am hoping for something soon so LFS will stay ahold of my relatively short attention span.

I get the similar thoughts with the GTRs. Some people lift throttle when they shift, like I do, but some don't and there is the adventage of it. As the current engine damage is no where to be seen they just get away with it. Starting the FXR off the line with full throttle and just releasing the clutch will blow any real race car's transmission and clutch immediatelly. But it's the only way to start the car... And using the non-realistic high nose setups is just disrespectful for others and the game. Everyone using them (maybe outside the oval) are cowards/idi**s to me.

[L(Oo)ney]

Although on the plus side, we do know everything that is happening at the moment, with test patches being so regular.

The only thing we know, is that not a lot is happening atm.

Unless you consider a language update to be something on the top of the list of "important things to finish". :pillepall

I think, in the next two years, we might have S2 final. Im not holding my breath though, just incase.

[Blowtus]

I get the similar thoughts with the GTRs. Some people lift throttle when they shift, like I do, but some don't and there is the adventage of it. As the current engine damage is no where to be seen they just get away with it. Starting the FXR off the line with full throttle and just releasing the clutch will blow any real race car's transmission and clutch immediatelly. But it's the only way to start the car... And using the non-realistic high nose setups is just disrespectful for others and the game. Everyone using them (maybe outside the oval) are cowards/idi**s to me.

you may like to attempt to make up for the games limitations, but in a competitive league there is no way for any of it to be policed, it's better to accept the flaws and make the best setup / driving strategy you can, imho.

[NotAnIllusion]

Until of course, this "feature" is amended to compensate for more realistic setups.

Funny thing.. The other day I got fed up with taking my FXR around As3 with a slightly nose (my regular setup) and decided to make a realistic set where the nose doesn't point towards the sky. Result? Well, reducing the front ride height increased the downforce effect of the wings, especially the front so I was about 8 kph slower on the straights and not significantly faster in corners. Reduced the front wing (and rear, it wasn't sliding at all out of corners). Now the set is just as fast in a straight line, and in corners during the first two laps. Reducing the DF caused my tyres to melt quicker than a plain vanilla ice cream in a Finnish sauna.

What now? I'm not sure.. unless I can find a way to reduce tyre wear I have no option but to stick with my current set, being another 1 sec slower versus XRR/FZR ain't gonna happen. :(

[AndroidXP]

By getting the nose down you didn't increase downforce, you increased drag - so for the same speed in corners, you got way slower on the straights.

Other than the suspension reactions there are no bad things about a high nose. With a higher nose you simply get the same downforce for less drag.

[tristancliffe]

Actually, the high nose raises the center of gravity of the front of the car, and can make the handling go a bit wobbly. But this is more than compensated by the speed down the straights!

[NotAnIllusion]

I think it depends on the rest of the setup really.. I've attached a reference set and a low nose set based on the reference (made it just now so maybe not perfect..). The locked diffs improve handling characteristics, and I find the reference set is way easier to drive under braking because rear tends to move about a lot less. The one thing the reference set doesn't do well is turn :p

With a quick run on the test track As3 (I know it best) I managed to drive solid 1:44.5x with the low nose set, while usually I drive low-to-mid 44s with the reference set. Still, the fronts heated up to over 90 in 2 laps with the low nose set, that doesn't happen quite as quickly on the ref set.
Conclusion: I suppose it can be done, with the FXR at least. It does mean a change in driving style moving the from the locked diffs of the ref set to the LSDs on the low nose set.

Oh btw the ref set (flotch) is the one from the Inferno site, but with a few mods to make it turn beyond 5 laps..

Hehe, and not to make this post entire off topic, I'll guess the next big (read: incompatible) patch will appear no sooner than next year. :)