Sending setups, what has changed

[Woz]

I don't know if its down to a different group of people or if people have changed mentality but back in the S1 days 99% of people would send you a setup if you asked but this is not the case with S2. People ignore requests or mock people etc.

[sil3ntwar]

majority of the people i ask send. If they dont they usually say its a team setup which is fine. People do not have to share their setups just because you ask.

[mrodgers]

I agree, it seems folks were a lot "friendlier" even in the S2 demo. Of course, I get a lot of "using race_1 set" when I ask if someone has a good set. Maybe just not many have a setup.

[Tweaker]

But sometimes it is true, the race_1 set is perfectly fine if you don't have a setup of your own. In the CoRe server we all used that setup at one point, to have fair races, but to make it easy so that people would all have the same set.

I give my setups to as many people as I can -- mostly because I don't make them and got them online someplace. No reason to keep it to yourself if you found it online for public download. But when big races come up, and I work on strategy and stuff, I can't give it to them, which is understandable. It's just some people are given sets where they are sworn not to pass it out (teams and stuff), but other times people really just dont like to share because they think they will start losing soon after. :shrug:

[Chaos]

I agree, it seems folks were a lot "friendlier" even in the S2 demo. Of course, I get a lot of "using race_1 set" when I ask if someone has a good set. Maybe just not many have a setup.
Well in the late S1 times there were good sets on inferno for 99% of the tracks/cars, so when everybody could download a good set , there was no point of sharing them online... nowadays some think that they win mainly because of their set, so the are not willing to share it... but it's a common thing that is't 80% the driver not the set who wins the race... I have no probs sharing my sets... When someone asks for a set I have, I share...

[Woz]

People do not have to share their setups just because you ask.

Yes, you are 100% correct. But I was only trying to find out what had changed in the community because is old S1 days most people would send setups and this is no longer the case.

[szyszek]

People ignore requests or mock people etc.

About ingoring: here's my experience. If there are 15 people on a serv, and you ask for a setup like "Can anyone share their ss" everyone thinks that someone else sent it to you (when in fact no one does). My advise: ask somebody particular :thumb:


Happened to me many times. OH! And also sometimes it's hard to send a setup (find the right person in a huge list of 20 people) when you're going 270 in the F08.

[avih]

Yes, you are 100% correct. But I was only trying to find out what had changed in the community because is old S1 days most people would send setups and this is no longer the case.

I'll have to agree. You can still get setups, but more ppl these days don't give them easily.. :/

[Shotglass]

one guy actually called me lazy (plus something else i dont really remember but to me it was pretty rude) when i asked him politely to send me his setup ... even though he had a crc tag in his nickname ..

[gloom]

I don't know if its down to a different group of people or if people have changed mentality but back in the S1 days 99% of people would send you a setup if you asked but this is not the case with S2. People ignore requests or mock people etc.

I figure in S2 setups really make the difference.
It`s totally legitimate in my eyes not to give somebody else your setup, because one might have worked for hours on it to get an advantage.

I sometimes ask and if I get a setup I am happy, if not, then I can totally understand.
especially since drivers who can make good setups often participate in leagues and such.

[Rotary]

Sometimes when racing it can be very distracting to SS, so maybe another reason for being ignored is becuase the driver is also concentrating on finishing first (or waiting for a straight). I know I've done that numerous times, but normally remember to SS once finished racing.

Actually, S1 in it's first days I found to be very bad for getting setups off people. In S2 I've personally noticed a lot more setup swapping.

[Woz]

Sometimes when racing it can be very distracting to SS, so maybe another reason for being ignored is becuase the driver is also concentrating on finishing first (or waiting for a straight). I know I've done that numerous times, but normally remember to SS once finished racing.

Actually, S1 in it's first days I found to be very bad for getting setups off people. In S2 I've personally noticed a lot more setup swapping.

True, it might settle down a little in a few months as S2 is new so people are still tweaking. But most times when I ask is normally after the race has finished so not to distract drivers who are racing.

[Rotary]

That sucks, nothing more frustrating than not having a decent setup! Feel free to ask for a setup from me, most likely I'll be sending a slightly modified setup from http://setupfield.teaminferno.hu/

[Bob Smith]

I always share setups if asked - but only after the race has finished. PRIORITIES!

[tpa]

On public servers are always share my setups if I am being asked NICELY.
Lately I am getting the impression that many racers assume it's their right to get my setup and forget about the etiquette :really:

Also, I can understand if people in leagues won't share their setups with their competitors :nod: :haha:

[Chaos]

Word, WORD ... ppl always ask: please can u share your set??? when you're middle in a good race, and if u don't answer (becuse your busy) then they go again: PLEASE CAN U SHARE YOUR SET??? ... 10 times!!!

Please c'mon i'm in a race atm (and when i'm racing i don't wanna pull over to send u my set, or even talk to you).
:iagree:, patience is the keyword here...

[Nard]

Yeah, but then again, I always send a preparation message like: "Hey, <insert random name here> after the race, would you mind sharing your set?"


This usually gives me a set at the end of the race. Sometimes, I have to remind the guy, or he may not have seen the message in race, but what happens too much, is even before I can ask again, boom he's disconnected. :mad:

[MyBoss]

About ingoring: here's my experience. If there are 15 people on a serv, and you ask for a setup like "Can anyone share their ss" everyone thinks that someone else sent it to you (when in fact no one does). My advise: ask somebody particular :thumb:




yep. that works for me to :nod:

[Doorman]

Nobody ever asks me for my set :( . But from what I see attitude is the keyword here. I scrolled a long way down this thread before the 'P' word came up. People come on and simply say 'Anyone got a set?' or 'give me a set' or some such. I've seen really hot drivers happily share their sets when it is requested which, if you think about it, is daft. Can you imagine the Ferrari team nipping along to the McLaren pit and saying 'give me your set for Nurburgring' 'Say please then' :D

Manners, manners and a few more manners.

Oh, and nothing has changed. :)

[BlueShaun]

I`ll always share mine with someone who asks politely, as its still 90% down to the driver.

I`ve refused on some occasions, when people who have taken me out while recovering from a spin or while being lapped ask for it.

[szyszek]

the 'P' word came up

"piss off?" :tilt:

yeah I know.. silly joke
I don't ask the guy who came first (because everybody else does and it must get a bit irritating)

Hah, very good point :)

[Rumiko]

Well, like Doorman said, it's very unlikely someone won't send his set, if you ask politely (and won't cause any accidents in the race). There's nothing worse than taking out a fast driver and later ask for his set...
League racing is a different story.

Once I was in a bad mood... blocked messages and was just driving around Aston for hours. Not sure if anyone asked for a set, but it was very refreshing not having to read any messages once in a while :tilt:


Rotary: Ahh.. you changed your avatar. I liked the cute character you had on RSC, damn you :( :D

[operator0]

I give mine out now. I figure I've had enough "private" time with it, so now I share. As a previous poster said, it's seriously irritating to have someone ask 20 times while I'm racing. I cannot type/use the mouse while I'm racing and so don't give sets out or argue with another racer while I'm racing. The best way to get me to block messages is for someone to start spamming about sets while a race is on. That person can expect to not see a set from me for the rest of the day...at least.


I also wont give sets out to anyone who pissed me off previously. I have a list of people I'm very pissed off at and a list of people I'm only mildly pissed off at. It's taped to my monitor with explenations as to what pissed me off...so I don't forget. I also keep replays of the person's idiocy to refresh my animosity. The people who really pissed me off will never recieve any kind of help from me...ever... and can expect a certain amount of dispariging comments every time I see them on a server. The people who I'm only mildly pissed of at can expect my help sometime in the future...usualy a couple of months later...when I've calmed down some. Yes, I'm an asshole. I don't know if any of you do the same thing, but I suspect that at least a few do. This might be another reason why some people percieve a certain amount of selfishness.

That being said, if someone's been a clean racer or respectfull (following blue flag protocall religiously)..I give it to them without being asked and try to help them with thier lines/racecraft in between races.

[Rotary]

I'm just glad that most the good sets can be found at Inferno's website... many of which I use as a base for the ones I use. Comes in very handy.

Rumiko: How's that, better? ;) Her name is Rikku from Final Fantasy X & X-2

[Rob76]

I have a list of people I'm very pissed off at and a list of people I'm only mildly pissed off at. It's taped to my monitor with explenations as to what pissed me off...so I don't forget. I also keep replays of the person's idiocy to refresh my animosity. The people who really pissed me off will never recieve any kind of help from me...ever... and can expect a certain amount of dispariging comments every time I see them on a server. The people who I'm only mildly pissed of at can expect my help sometime in the future...usualy a couple of months later...when I've calmed down some.


:D

If I did that I wouldn't see my screen for post it notes. LOL

[banshee56]

The only time I don't share sets are when some yahoo comes onto the server while we are in mid-race, and says something like "need a set", and that's it. Then, if no one sends them a set, they ask the same way, usually with a bit more rudeness. Anytime I ask for a set, I usually say something like "Will you share your set please". I just hate when people come on and demand a set, then expect to be treated like a king.

[JeDa]

Hmmm,
Actually last night somebody asked me for my setup, which is a compliment for my driving :) because I use the default setup so he allready had it... but if I HAD a different setup I shouldn't know how to send it :(

How can you send a setup? I really miss a manual which explains those basic features....

[JeDa]

Just found the old S1 manual:

How to send and receive setups online
It's easy, if you want to send someone your current setup, press N until the connection list shows up in the bottom right of your screen, then press SS next to the person you want to give the setup to.

If someone sends you a setup, once again get the connection list up, and press the green iluminated button next to their name. This will open a "save as" box, give the setup a name and save.


Didn't know that...

[RMachucaA]

Shotglass: That was me :), dont be mad, be encouraged to do your own :D.

K, heres the deal for me... I HATE it when people go "send set, thanks", like I owe them something and im supposed to send my set?! forget it. if you ask "i noticed your set is good, can i try it?" 90% of the time i'll send it if you dont backtalk, and be patient, cause i SPEND the time to see that particular person, and determine if a set would help, a lot of the times the people asking cant even keep a straight line, my set would do nothing but make things worse for them.

Secondly, i do my own sets, i dont rely on anyone, i may ask for help with certain adjustments, but i dont ask for sets... why you may ask? very simple answer, to be fast, you need to know why you are slow, diagnose the problem and fix it to fit YOUR driving style. So i spend hours upon hours tweaking a set for ME, and some random person wants it scott free? hell no. If i race with the person and im familiar with them, ok, i will send it, but for anyone else....haaaaaardly.

Thirdly, i ENCOURAGE people to do their own sets, i TELL them im open for any questions they may have, i will GLADLY help them adjusting their sets, i want to contribute to the society, this encourages people to KNOW why they are fast, become better racers, and learn not to depend on any joe schmoe's set.

Any questions?

BTW, if you saw someone asking for a set to a certain someone, and this certain someone replied he got it online...

then the askee goes "Where!!??? i want it!!"

and this person replied www.im-too-lazy-to-do-my-own-set.com (http://www.im-too-lazy-to-do-my-own-set.com/)

It was me :P.



EDIT: And BTW, i was this way in S1 too, so nothing changed.

[juggle]

I am one of the poor folks who are inept at building my own sets.

I am always grateful to the owners of good setups who share them. It invariably means ive got loads of sets to play with, that i know people have done good times with, and gives me a base to build from.

I rarely use them as is from the sender. Apart from goop and Viperosi who have a car balance that i enjoy.

And one other thing i have never been as quick as the person who was kind enough to share.

:)

[Krane]

I get a lot of "using race_1 set" when I ask if someone has a good set.For the FWD and GTR cars the Race_1 sets are very good, on many tracks I can get within 1 second of the WR with them and that's about the fastest time I can get with any set...

[priits]

with any set :lol:

don't be stupid :)

[Sunday Driver]

I'm sure he meant he is with the given race1 setS in most cases as fast as with any WR set up, which you can download everywhere. So it's mainly the driver on whom good lap times depends.

When I try downloaded WR setups, which should makes me 6 seconds faster per lap, I'm still as slow as using my customized set up. :tilt:

Nevertheless I take the downloaded set ups as inspiration to develop new set ups which fits more my driving style. Although I'm still unexperienced with set-up issues, it's for me a pleasant pursuit to figure out some new settings and test them on the track. By doing this I also get more experience how to drive a new track.

[bbman]

So it's mainly the driver on whom good lap times depends.

When I try downloaded WR setups, which should makes me 6 seconds faster per lap, I'm still as slow as using my customized set up. :tilt:

Nevertheless I take the downloaded set ups as inspiration to develop new set ups which fits more my driving style. Although I'm still unexperienced with set-up issues, it's for me a pleasant pursuit to figure out some new settings and test them on the track. By doing this I also get more experience how to drive a new track.
Just the same here... :D

[Shotglass]

Shotglass: That was me :), dont be mad, be encouraged to do your own :D.

K, heres the deal for me... I HATE it when people go "send set, thanks", like I owe them something and im supposed to send my set?! forget it.

you could of course just say no instead of calling everybody lazy ... part of beaing a clean racer ...

[RMachucaA]

Dont you think its better if i offer what little i know instead? knowledge is priceless, sets are free ;)

[JamesF1]

Well, this applies for the whole of vMaxSR, including myself:
We are happy to send setups that we have, except in the case that we are currently developing a setup for a league, or such. We're even ready to give advice on how to set up one's car properly.

[--==Gogo==--]

Drive 100 Laps and you'll be about 1 sec faster. Without any change in the setup!
Thats my experience.

I made a 1.18.xxx on FE Green with the XFR. An other racer had 1:13.xxx. I asked him for setup and I got it. But the car was even more difficult to drive than with my setup.
Well. After a few hours i was driving 1.15.xxx with my setup. And I'm sure if i go for a few more hours I can make low 1:14!

It's useless to try different setups if you are not able to drive clear laps with your setup. And with clear laps I mean 10+ in a row.

Just my 2 cents...

[tristancliffe]

Well, this applies for the whole of vMaxSR, including myself:
We are happy to send setups that we have, except in the case that we are currently developing a setup for a league, or such. We're even ready to give advice on how to set up one's car properly.

We are?

I mean sure, I share my sets except private league/team sets, but advising people on how to setup a car?

First I need to learn myself!

:D

[Racer Y]

Hi. I flatout suck at making setups, Get the suspenion right, re do the brakes. the brakes get reset now the suspensions is too soft...ARRRGHHH!

but people give me decent setups so, I'm OK :)
I noticed that most people seem to think that a set-up is all that separates them from having a WR or something. That is not the case. It usually takes me
a couple of hours in single player to get used to a new set up.
Also. the setups in S-2 seem to be more player specific. I'm an early braker.
What good would a set up used by a late braker do for me? or vice versa?

Uh as far as asking for a set up, I don't usually ask a particular person
and I don't ask during a race. and I always say thankyou.

@RMauchua... LOL I remember one night my driving was so pathetically slow, you practically MADE me take one of your setups.

I don't get asked for setups much, But I save the setups I get in the person's name that gave it to me so when or if I do get asked, I'll tell them what name it is so thay can have an honest idea who made it.

[ajp71]

I find it more polite to not ask particular people, that way you won't get issues with people not wanting to share there sets.

How can you send a setup? I really miss a manual which explains those basic features....

Press N to bring up the connections box.

To send a set click the SS next to the correct name.

If someone has sent you a set the S will light up green, click it and type the name you want to save it as.

Press N twice again to hide the connections box/names over cars.

[Gunn]

When I try downloaded WR setups, which should makes me 6 seconds faster per lap, I'm still as slow as using my customized set up. :tilt:
The thing to remember when using someone else's set is that you will probably need to change your style to get the most out of it. This feels odd to us when we try to do it, so early on it is easy to become frustrated with someone else's set. Using WR sets is no different, but often the set created to make a WR hotlap will leave little room for error. For each foreign set you try some adjustment of your style or attitude must shift to compliment the setup if you want to get the most out of it.

If we consider a WR set for a moment, and analyse its main characteristics we can get an insight into how the creator of the set got his WR time. At first we may think "how the hell can this guy drive this piece of crap setup?" but instead of trying to drive the car as we are used to, it is interesting to try and fit yourself to that set. If the set has suspension that is way too soft for our tastes we must consider why it is made that way, if the the gearing seems wierd we can analyse how best to make use of it on that circuit etc. Rather than fighting against the setup's oversteer or understeer it is better to find out how to cause the car the to oversteer or understeer when using that particular setup. With practice comes the knowledge of how early the set will turn in, how throttle variation effects cornering, what are the limits of the brakes and gearing and many other characteristics that make that set a potential WR maker.

Using this method in S1 helped me to understand many things about setups, but also many things about drivers who break the records, or get close. The knowledge of the latter was to change the way I drive in LFS and make a huge difference to my lap times and overall performance. Although I still can't best these great drivers and personally boast very, very few top 10 hotlaps, my perfomance is now consistent, I am generally faster on every track and I make all of my own sets myself. The realisation of how a particular set can allow the car to be used to get good lap times has led me to reflect on and improve my driving. I never would have reached that point if I had not persited with someone else's setup, a setup that I was ready to write off after only a few minutes of frustrated driving.

Someone else's set taught me to be a better driver, and becoming a better driver taught me how to make sets that are competitive for me.

I guess the moral of the story is, don't be put off if at first a WR set seems undrivable. There is much to be learned from racers who are faster than us. Through LFS World and the other tools available to us we can identify where we can improve our driving and setups. Those mad buggers at the top of the WR charts have something to teach us and LFS allows us the possibility to learn from them, whether they like it or not! :D

[KiDCoDEa]

:iagree:, patience is the keyword here...

actually the key is "-"

;)

[Tweaker]

Heh, that reminds me KiD....

When pressing "-" to block any usual chatter while driving and concentrating, apparently I get a lot of requests for having my setup. I have no problem with giving my set, but some people think I am automatically ignoring them and I am being greedy. They get angry, frustrated, man.... and the funny part is, once I give them my setup, half the time they will do good, but other times they cannot drive the car at all still. They just don't know how-to drive, and 'setups' are sometimes the only excuse some people have to doing bad :(.

Plus, when I am driving on the track practicing some laps during or after the race, I will ignore requests to send a setup... because I am driving! If I mess up, or take a rest, I will then send a setup, but sheesh, some people need to know what the person is doing before thinking they won't pass out a fast set.

[Ryanry64]

I usually send my setup if someone ask's nicely for it, I mean if someone say, Munko send your set, I'm probably not going to do it, but if someone say's, Munko, could I try that setup please, then of course I'll send it if it isn't a team-set. Which 90% of the time it isn't.

Moral of the story is, ask nicely and usually ye shall recieve ;)


P.S : RMachucaA, from the BC forums too, right? ;)

[MAD3.0LT]

i wanna make sets that have no damper and no rebound for people that cant drive and are impatiant so i can watch them bounce around the track :D

i have spent over 20+ hours trying to tune other sets and make my own they allways end up a little snappy on the back end :(

[ColeusRattus]

Usually I share my setups if I am asked nicely, allthough, after some fruitless tries to build some from scratch (except for the FXR on BL GP :D), I ended up downloading my sets from http://setupfield.teaminferno.hu (http://setupfield.teaminferno.hu/) and tweaking them handlingwise to fit my tastes (and/or racelength).

But I found out that setups (if not totally screwed) only help to gain a few hundreths of seconds per lap. The main portion is (the lack of) driving skill.

Only yesterday I raced with T7R/Bismarck on a racing-challenge server. We both used the very same setup (not intentionally...), but he kept going three to four secs faster per lap than me. So he just gave me one single tip: "Don't drift!" Sure, I did not drift intentionally, but after this, I drove even more carefully around the corners and managed to improve my 4-lap record by nearly 12 seconds within just two races. Which has propably kicked me from the good rookies to the mediocre to bad pros... So there goes the chance to win this race weekend :D

Another ímportant thing for being fast, which only has little to do with the setup: Don't shift too late. Shifting slightly above the peak power will increase your acceleration a lot.

[tristancliffe]

Don't shift too late. Shifting slightly above the peak power will increase your acceleration a lot.

Just shift when the red light comes on - that red light indicates the OPTIMUM shift point. Any earlier/later is reducing your potential tractive effort, and hence torque at the wheels.

12 secs over 4 laps in 2 races is a good improvement! Well done :D May I ask what car/track combo it was? I mean, 3 secs a lap in the UF1 at Aston Grand Prix is not as good as 3 secs improvement in the FOX at Aston Cadet (shorter track, faster car).

[ColeusRattus]

12 secs over 4 laps in 2 races is a good improvement! Well done :D May I ask what car/track combo it was? I mean, 3 secs a lap in the UF1 at Aston Grand Prix is not as good as 3 secs improvement in the FOX at Aston Cadet (shorter track, faster car).

Thx! Current Racing-Challange config: BW GP with XRG. That's pretty much all I drive ATM... damn Racing-Challange, keeping me away from fully enjoying the S2, as it is just a Demo-Challange :D

[bbman]

*cough* XRG... *cough* ;)

[Pabs(Sco)]

On a side note, some people will block messages in race too, so they wont get to see the request.

[RMachucaA]

Yep, im at the BC forums too :P.

Anyhow, to conclude this topic, most people will send their sets if politely requested, but please be understanding if:
-the person you are req. the set from is driving
-is fine tuning the team set
-is working on a set and is slower then default (has happened to me :P, car feels good but its slow, so i fine tune till i beat WR with a nice driving car)
-has blocked messages
-just plain doesnt want to share the fruits of his labour (working 5 hrs on 1 set is not unusual for me)

[ColeusRattus]

*cough* XRG... *cough* ;)

Roight... I changed it... dang, still confusing the cars. Heck, they shouldn't be so similar when in the same class :D

Oh, and yeah, try to wait until the race is over or the one you want to ask for a set is pitting. While racing, I usually don't chat or send/request setups, and the more annoying the request is, the less willing I am to share. especially if it is homegrown ;)

[Hitman_MT]

@JeDa

press 2 times "n" so that you can see a list of all people on the server down at right. then press on the "ss" behind the name where you want send the setup. done :)

Hitman_MT