Car resetting fixxed

[Xalies]

I hate it when ya cash and need to reset(I'm sure others do to), you do it but the car resets and is stuck in the kitty littler or on a ripple strip and can't move ... so you end up needing to return to pits just so you can go again

How about making it so it resets you on the track in a safe place and off the racing line

[Stellios]

Yes, i agree.

Although if you went itno the gravel trap in real life you would be stuck, its just makes a game boring as you have to start the race again from the pits. Resetting the car off the trap (with say a 5 second reset delay) would mean you lose time while in the trap and then a set penalty time for resetting.

Just a thought

[Noccy]

no dont agree
if u get stuck ,u get stuck
if u go offroad alot, jack up your ridehight and u can drive over most sandtraps.
it adds to the tension in long races or just when hitting a sandtrap and trying to keep speed so u dont get stuck.

reset allready bugs me when u see ppl abuse it to recover fast from a spin ,just resest and blast away in the right correction..no waiting for traffic or wrestling your car in the right direction.

[Xalies]

Thats why a time penaly as Stellios would be good

[X-Ter]

I agree. I don't use the reset option very often since it's usually don't do much good. But a reset option with a timedelay would be more than ok if it put you back on track.
I know it's not "real" to have it that way, but for the sake of gameplay, it should at least be there as a server option. Just imagine to be the one putting the car in the trap during a 24 hour race and having to explain to your team mates that you went off and ruined the race for them all.
5 seconds seem a little low though. I could go for up to as much as a couple of minutes.

[bobvanvliet]

I know it's not "real" to have it that way, but for the sake of gameplay, it should at least be there as a server option. Just imagine to be the one putting the car in the trap during a 24 hour race and having to explain to your team mates that you went off and ruined the race for them all.
I agree with the idea that it should be a server-side option to allow or dissalow resetting of the car, this way random-join-servers can be very playable and league admins can make their server as "realistic" as they want. :thumb:

[tristancliffe]

I've always felt the solution to the reset not working issue was not to crash in the first place. If you do (and we all do) accept that you suddenly lost all ability to drive. If the reset doesn't work, accept that the spin/crash/incident was a race ending one.

I think the most important thing needed after crashes now is major engine/drivetrain damage. Nothing visual to start with, just the inability to stop people trying to drive back to the pits with utterly wrecked cars. i.e. after a crash the engine stops. Pressing I to start it results in the message "You are a noob, you engine/gearbox/driveshafts are borken. Learn to drive".

[xaotik]

Pressing I to start it results in the message "You are a noob, you engine/gearbox/driveshafts are borken. Learn to drive".

Well, some accidents are not in your control... and no I don't mean divine intervention, just other drivers.

I think it's a good idea (more-so with the server-config idea) and the time penalty sort of simulates marshalls helping you out because some cars, no matter what setup you have on them will get stuck in some tracks.

Getting bumped off in a UF1 at Fern Bay Club Rev's second chicane before the last turn usually ends up with you in the pit before the inside barrier of the said turn and the UF1 is just the right size to get jammed in there with no damage what-so-ever.

[skiingman]

Pressing I to start it results in the message "You are a noob, you engine/gearbox/driveshafts are borken. Learn to drive".

Did I miss something? I've never actually had my car stall after a spin...I thought that was a feature we were still waiting for?

[tristancliffe]

Erm, if you read my post you'd see that I want the engine to stop in large crashes, and not be restartable. So yeah, it's something we're still waiting for...

[keiran]

I wish space and reseting didnt exist. Its a pain when some n00b goes flying down the wrong track on the first lap (i.e past the tyres and driving the wrong config) and suddenly appears on the outside of the corner where you are. It ends up ruining your race. I like LFS for the fact if I go off into the gravel theres a chance that I'll get stuck. To me this adds an extra factor while racing in long races and makes me think if it's worth pushing so hard around a certain corner with gravel compared to a corner with grass.

Keiran

[geeman1]

Yeah. Resetting should be indeed a server option. It would add so much realism when in you just could not reset your car or even teleport to the pits when you get stuck/on the roof. Sure it would be annoying in long race to screw up, but that's the way life is, you can't win all the time.
But it would be better if it was a server option because not so serious servers could have it on so that you would not get overly annoyed because someone wrecked you on the first corner in a public server or you made a little mistake that caused you ending stuck.

[Woz]

Yeah. Resetting should be indeed a server option. It would add so much realism when in you just could not reset your car or even teleport to the pits when you get stuck/on the roof. Sure it would be annoying in long race to screw up, but that's the way life is, you can't win all the time.
But it would be better if it was a server option because not so serious servers could have it on so that you would not get overly annoyed because someone wrecked you on the first corner in a public server or you made a little mistake that caused you ending stuck.

A server option to do the following.

- No reset
- No join after race start
- No jump to pits

You crash or get stuck somewher and you can't limp to pits for repair then your race is over, just as would be the case IRL.

Take the Bathurst 1000 that just took place. 4 of the top drivers out on lap one then many others not finishing. Cars in nightmare condition and on rims limping around the track to get back to pits. The pit crew then take big hammers and gaffer tape to the bodywork to patch the car up. One team did half the race without front and rear windows after getting hit by a flying wheel.

[Rebeldevil]

It seems to me to take an awfully long time to come to a stop over the kitty litter. Aren't those gravel traps supposed to slow you down a lot more? I slid into one doing maybe about 60 MPH and continued sliding until I hit a wall.

I've noticed a couple other minor issues when taking damage.
1. Bodywork sometimes clips into the tires. This doesn't seem to have any effect on the tires themselves. If there's bodywork cutting into the tires, that tire needs to blow, and quickly.
2. I have seen some thoroughly MANGLED cars manage to limp their way back to the pits after surviving crashes in which the driver should have been KILLED (roof is caved in, driver's helmet is sticking through...sure sign he's a goner) And I should know, I've driven some of those smoking wrecks. :D (the in-car view made me a little queasy...) If it's estimated the driver would sustain serious injury or death in the wreck, the race should be over for you. That would probably cut down on a lot of the kamikaze driving I see. (Of course, this should be turned off when hot-lapping, so we can screw up with impunity)

And I'd also like to note, the only time I ever really finding myself hitting the reset button is when I've been in a major crash and flipped the car onto its side/roof. This happens more often than I'd like.

[Sk0rp]

Im my oppionion it os the best and easiest way to to is a serversided option.
The option should allow a reset to the pits. This option shouldnt replace the normal "car-reset-button". Something like shift+"Car-reset-button" would be great.
Example: A race with 50 laps on oval with F08. The leader crashes in lap 35 himself (without other fault). Then he should press shift+"Car-Reset-Button" and will be set to the pits with 34/35 laps on the screen. There should be the ability to repair the car and drive on the race. The lap increasement have to be individually on each track. (Reset before finish line= -2 ||| Reset afer finish line= -1 ||| so that cheating with this option isn´t possible!

Then the race isn´t over for the driver!
But the driver has an disadvantage for the crash!
If he would crash now...
1. The driver trys to reach the pits for repairs and handicaps the other drivers!
2. He would press "GO-Back-to-Pits-Button" and is much frusttrated of the lost race, because he has to start in lap 1 !!!!!!!

How do you like that suggestion??

[geeman1]

Example: A race with 50 laps on oval with F08. The leader crashes in lap 35 himself (without other fault). Then he should press shift+"Car-Reset-Button" and will be set to the pits with 34/35 laps on the screen. There should be the ability to repair the car and drive on the race. The lap increasement have to be individually on each track. (Reset before finish line= -2 ||| Reset afer finish line= -1 ||| so that cheating with this option isn´t possible!

Then the race isn´t over for the driver!
But the driver has an disadvantage for the crash!
If he would crash now...
1. The driver trys to reach the pits for repairs and handicaps the other drivers!
2. He would press "GO-Back-to-Pits-Button" and is much frusttrated of the lost race, because he has to start in lap 1 !!!!!!!

How do you like that suggestion??
No. That would just be unrealistic. If you crash, you must suffer the consequences.

[Fonnybone]

no dont agree
if u get stuck ,u get stuck
if u go offroad alot, jack up your ridehight and u can drive over most sandtraps.
it adds to the tension in long races or just when hitting a sandtrap and trying to keep speed so u dont get stuck.

reset allready bugs me when u see ppl abuse it to recover fast from a spin ,just resest and blast away in the right correction..no waiting for traffic or wrestling your car in the right direction.

Considering how it USED to be you could reset at any speed, the fact that
you need to come to a stop (<5mph i think) is not what i'd call "recover fast
from a spin". As much as i understand your view on the realistic aspect of
going off-road, you are talking about not having the reset at ALL, which
isn't really the issue here. The reset IS there, making it NOT usefull is
pointless imo. Instead, we should ask, how can we make it usefull without
making it unrealistic to the point where it is used strategically ? It's simply
there because bugs happen and getting stuck in a wall is not realistic either.

I can come up with pages of argument to counter all you purists. I can agree
with a server option to dissalow reset altogether, i just don't agree with
limiting it's usefullness, it is a tool after all. The time penalty is a nice example
of a compromise. Fact is, irl you have track marshalls, tow trucks and flags to
control traffic. None of this is implemented in LFS. How many real races do
you see where a car goes off-road and just stays there until it's over ?!
In that case, not having any reset means you could always use the pit
button, but this isn't realistic either now is it...

[Noccy]

i never said anywhere i want to have reset removed.
But like many others here i like the extra tension sandtraps bring. U learn to take those corners a bit easier ,maybe put your ridehight 15mm higher(not much slower..but big difference in sandtraps).

But im arguing AGAINST making reset even more of an acrade help. It allready is annoying right now. for example..had a race where the leader spun out, stopped with his nose 180° on drivingdirection and facing cars flying towards him midcorner so he couldnt do a 180° and blast off again without waiting.
Well he just hit reset the instant his car came to a stop and drove on..didnt have to wait for cars to pass,didnt have to align his car again..just reset and off we go.
which is definatly a fast recover if u consider how long it would take normally
So im agruing about making reset even worse in that aspect.

However i do like your idea for a timepenalty. IF it is implemented right. So u go in the sandtrap, u wait for the towcrane to arrive and have them pull u out, or if your car is too damaged to continue they lift u over the wall.
Should make everyone happy..u can continue after trying some paris dakar and getting stuck , u get a timepenalty, and noone uses reset to gain stupid advantages.
Imo it would feel stupid to get stuck ,resest ,get a message "10seconds will be added to your racetime" and thats it.

[X-Ter]

I agree that it should take time, there and then. Time added to final time just isn't the same.

[Lola Popeye]

back to pits with 1 or 2 lap penalty is fine.

look at it this way, there are a few overweight lazy track marshall i see around the tracks, but im sure they wont just sit there and admire the car when it goes in the kitty and gets stuck. What are safety cars for? So the race is slowed while the wreck is getting cleared, and that doesnt usually involve teleporting car out sumplace. A tow truck comes, and when the car gets towed out.....well your not stuck anymore are you? :D but you will have lost time/position, which is simulated by the 1/2 laps down.


this is a bigger issue in the enduros, 5 lappers, dont worry. I'd suggest options for admins of leagues

[JamesF1]

If we want a REALISTIC sim, we have to go for realistic options. If you get stuck, that should be the end of it - why resetting? I can't count how many times I've had a race wrecked by someone resetting.

[Vain]

And can you count how often you've been wrecked by someone else (uninentionally or intentionally) and had to reset?
Wouldn't you be dead frustrated if someone wrecked you and you couldn't rejoin the race in any way?
My opinion: Resetting takes a minute, then you're placed on a safe spot on the track.
That also hinders wreckers, because they have to sit around waiting most of the time.

Vain

[Doorman]

LFS must be growing up. Another intersting thread with points well argued.
I wouldn't mind betting my dinner money that most of you, in the event of kitty littering, do the following:
TRY to get out of said KL by normal means. If unlucky try a reset, if successful, wait till you can rejoin safely and carry on the race.
If unsuccessful, slap forehead and go to spectate.
I find the idea of having a mishap, go to pit and restarting from lap 1 a pointless exersize. After all, it's a sim isn't it?

[Fonnybone]

Actually, this might be good also. Instead of a reset button, you could have
a marshall 'request' which would simulate a real crash where you have to wait
for the marshalls. If the car is driveable, they'd wait for traffic to clear and try
to push the car back on track. Maybe LFS could look at traffic and wait until
the track is clear to 'push' you back on it. I'm just brainstorming here.

The biggest issue with reset imo is that it's the only way to keep your lap
count for now. It's very annoying to lose that everytime get stuck on a high
point in a sand track, or on a curb. If the pit button didn't count the lap
(don't pass Go, don't collect 200$), but still keep the lap count, it wouldn't
be an advantage while making racing in LFS more enjoyable. Sometimes i
swear i can barely finish one race. With all the crashes and the Start-to-
Turn1 bullrun, sometimes you just need a quick fix and don't want to lose 2
minutes in the pits while your perfectly good tires are being swapped...
All those things interact and the fact that none are perfect just makes it
worse for now.

-"Oh and kid, no need to fix that front wing, i don't mind, i'm kind of in a race
here. KID!!! Ahhh, nvm."

[NotAnIllusion]

I think resetting should be a server-side option, including a way to retain the lap-count if needed.

Due to nobody (?) wanting cars littered around the racetrack in the middle of the road, there should be a way to automatically force totalled (or if there's no-reset) cars off the road instead of them staying in the way.

Or perhaps resetting & pit-in could be allowed, but devise a way to force a pit-in in the above scenario and depending on the server options, not allow rejoining. It would ensure a clean racetrack for all while being fair(-ish).

Also if resetting is allowed, as Vain proposed, it'd be handy to prevent resetting until it's safe or force it in the next safe place behind the current location.

Having marshalls or a tow-truck pull yer wreck of a car out of the sand or tip it back on all 4s shouldn't happen because quite often once such ppl are needed, there's no resuming the race anyway (in RL). In fact there should be a feature that when you've totalled your car, you have to walk back to the pits yourself.. :)

[Noccy]

In sprintraces cars that get stuck in the sandtraps dont get pulled free. That is true, but they still get lifted over the wall by a towcrane.
And in endurance races u verry often see cars that got stuck being pulled free so they can continue their race.

So we could still use a crane in both..either to lift u behind the fence or to pull u free again.
Not only for realisms sake but also because it would be a nice visual feature for any racer :)

[Fonnybone]

That's actually a good idea also ;) Reminds me of one of those rip-off
games of Wipe-Out (zero-gravity racing ships). Out of the sky would come out a
crane to pick you up when you fell out of the track. You'd only see the boom
come out of the sky and the 'rope' hook on your car then you are 'reset' back on
track. In LFS, there could be some sort of crane that picks you up and puts you
back in pits. Ok, i'm pushing i guess, hehe.

As for the marshalls pushing a car back on track, i'm not sure where, but i've
seen it many times. Usually, when the car is simply out of traction, like on grass
or sand, a few guys will push the car until it can move on it's own. I've never
seen marshalls actually ON the track pushing a car though. There might be a
rule for that actually as cars have to finish 'under their own power".

[wheel4hummer]

How about full course cautions and pace car too?

[Unforgiven]

I like to race seriously but this is a joke. Why shouldnt people be able to reset out of a sandtrap If anyone watched Bathurst you will notice that Alex Tagliani got stuck in the gravel he was then towed out and sent on his way.

I dont know about anyone else in the LFS community but I like to have fun playing this sim. By that I mean Close racing, occasional rubbing of panels, and all the other things that come with an online "game", oh but I know its a sim.... Yes it is but its also a game.

Why does a "small" percentage of the LFS community want to take everything that makes the sim enjoyable out?

No reset means newer drivers ie. virgins would get frustrated with not being able to reset and like me would turn away thinking good sim but just not fun.

Keep up the good work devs but please reset my car on the grass or something not in the gravel trap!

Cheers
UN

[X-Ter]

It seems as most people in this thread agree that the reset option should be available, but with a time delay of sort to simulate the fact that track marshalls has to run to your car and manually push it back on track.
So the ultimate solution would be to have this as a server option.
Reset Possible - On/Off
Reset Delay - X seconds

Everyone should be happy and everyone could have exactly the sort of racing and rules they like. And chance of this being implemented?

[tailing]

I'm with Unforgiven, car reset is one of those things that greatly improves the playability of LFS and I don't see much reason to even allow it to be disabled server side.

[Henrik[SWE]]

So the ultimate solution would be to have this as a server option.
Reset Possible - On/Off
Reset Delay - X seconds

Everyone should be happy and everyone could have exactly the sort of racing and rules they like. And chance of this being implemented?

That is the answer???

[nesrulz]

']So the ultimate solution would be to have this as a server option.
Reset Possible - On/Off
Reset Delay - X seconds

Everyone should be happy and everyone could have exactly the sort of racing and rules they like. And chance of this being implemented?

That is the answer???

:thumb::thumb::thumb:

[Cue-Ball]

Personally, I would like to see the reset option go away or be disallowed on the server end. For hot lapping and single player it's fine, but for actual races I want to be able to turn it off.

I would like to setup my server like so:
No resetting allowed
Go to Pits option factors in a certain amount of towing time

It would work like so: I'm running a server with resetting not allowed. During the race if someone goes off track they need to try to drive back onto the track using their own power. If they're stuck in the sand and unable to rejoin they can choose to "go to pits". This would give them a message "Being towed to pits" and a delay (set by the server. short races could have a shorter delay while realistic 30 lappers could have a realistic delay of several minutes). After the delay is over they appear in the pits and are able to rejoin on whatever lap they failed to finish.

This would be realistic, would allow better control for league games and people who want more strict servers (like me) and would still be able to be turned off for banger racing or people who like having resetting available. Also, the program wouldn't have to factor in if it's safe to reset or not since resetting to the pits will always be safe to do.

So, I'm thinking more like:

Reset Possible - On/Off
Reset Delay - X seconds
Instant Go to Pits - On/Off
Go to Pits Delay - X seconds

[Fonnybone]

I like to race seriously but this is a joke. Why shouldnt people be able to reset out of a sandtrap If anyone watched Bathurst you will notice that Alex Tagliani got stuck in the gravel he was then towed out and sent on his way.

Yes. This is why i said if the car is still driveable, simulate marshalls pushing
it back on track, but only if there's no traffic. If the car is undriveable,
there should be a yellow flag and after a delay you'd be sent to the pits.
Perhaps even in repair-mode so you also have to wait for the car to be fixed,
none of that magical pit&fixed stuff. Heck, in some cases there could be a
full course yellow and a pace car, i'd love that myself.


I dont know about anyone else in the LFS community but I like to have fun playing this sim. By that I mean Close racing, occasional rubbing of panels, and all the other things that come with an online "game", oh but I know its a sim.... Yes it is but its also a game.

Why does a "small" percentage of the LFS community want to take everything that makes the sim enjoyable out?

How can you start out saying you don't know how others feel, then talk
about "a small percentage of them" ?! I'm not arguying your choice of words,
it's just that it's very hard to define this. You must realise that there are a lot
of people who have and use LFS that aren't "in the community". By that i
mean there are some that do not come to forums like this one or RSC. It's
hard to know their opinion so i'm not sure what a "small percentage of the
LFS community" really represents, especially as it's being based on a
subjective opinion.

In a way, it's a shame for them, because "a small percentage of the
LFS community" (i think this is the right context..) decides what LFS
should be. If Scawen has 98 e-mails asking for NOS and 2 asking
for none, how do you know if the majority agree. Statistically, 98%
want NOS. I'm sure you all see where this goes. Of course, i doubt
Scawen would include this, at least not in S2, so no amount of e-mails
should change that.


No reset means newer drivers ie. virgins would get frustrated with not being able to reset and like me would turn away thinking good sim but just not fun.

Keep up the good work devs but please reset my car on the grass or something not in the gravel trap!


Exactly. I'm not new at all and i get frustrated when i get reset in a sand trap
which i can't get out of. Might as well pit me. I don't think it's got to do with
fun. The issue here is that the current reset is NOT working well, so it should
be fixed. This is where i'm very open. I would take a better reset that sticks
you back ON the track, but on the side and when there are no cars
approaching. I'd also like an option to disable reset and use a
Marshall/TowTruck approach where either you wait for the car to be 'pushed'
on track, or you get sent to pit with your wrecked car. Ideally, for me, would
be to disable reset once a race starts. Reset would only be enabled when
practicing before/after. Even Qualifying would benefit from a disabled reset.

For me, the fun is getting in the mood of a real race driver. ;)

[wheel4hummer]

Until later releases maybe the next patch should move the car off of the track, and then delay them before they can go to the pits.

[dave_w11]

One related thing I dont like is the 'jump to pit' ability. I haven't been online for a while so I don't know if it's still this way, but it seemed that if you crash and end up on the track you're expected to hit the pit button quick to get off the track. If someone crashed in front of me, I'd prefer them not too! It would be good if there was a server option to allow you only to go to the pit menu from within the pits.


As for the resetting, I'm of the opinion that real racing should be recreated as accurately as possible including the bad bits (or rather have server options so it can be made that way if desired). However, as pointed out there are times where you may be able to get back on track with the help of marshals etc. This obviously isn't simulated at the moment, so perhaps the ability to reset is a fair replacement?

[Pablo.CZ]

What about allow reset car only if no other player see yellow flag from reseting car to avoid reseting car "jumping" into racing line in front of another car and ruining his race.
I mean, if some other car is near, reset wont work and you must wait.
(sorry for my english)

[sgt.flippy]

That's a nice bump!

But I find the thread interesting and this should be discussed. I think resetting is quite useless, I myself never use it I think. Only on single player or when I'm on my roof. So I don't exploit it to get myself back in the right direction after a spin. Like many have said before, I'd like to see damage more expanded to engine, and a crash means forfait. Unless you are able to crawl back to the pits and repair.

[mabyenot]

sometimes this really annoys me this is supposed to be a race SIMULATOR

simulator - an attempt to recreate real life physics

in real life you cannot just press space and be put upright or magically fae the right direction

i wish the devs would take out the resetting alltogether.

in real life if u roll ur car and it stops on its roof or side that generally makes you out of the race.

only real exeption is in rally stages where the crowd usually push ur car back upright

but if they are trying to make the most realistic racing sim there is, why have a reset button?

[Scawen]

Something I've coded already but excluded from the recent test patches, because it's incompatible...

In the next incompatible version there will be two options :

- no resets allowed
- resets allowed

No resets will be the default option. Resets will get you out of the dirt and fix your car like in single player. Resets will be regarded as an "arcade" feature, more for first timers who don't yet know how to stay on the track (for example : in an arcade).

I'm wondering about the jump starts as well, if maybe the current start system should be lumped together with "resets allowed" into a single option known as "arcade mode".

If it was like that then Arcade Mode would be like the current LFS but with damage repair on reset plus removal from the gravel traps. Default Mode would disallow resets and allow jump starts.

But maybe those should be two different options - no big deal anyway, just thought I'd mention it, seeing this conversation about resets. It's not very realistic. :D

[Pablo.CZ]

2sgt.flippy: agreed. but now, reset is here and there is problem with people reseting car when someone is near and causing crash. this would be easy solution. imo its better than X seconds delay.

2mabyenot: reset is for situations you are on roof or side and its against playability in endu races if you must end if damage is minor. puting car magically to the right direction is bug, I agree, but putting car to the same direction as it was on roof, why not..
Im for no reset option on HC servers too.

EDIT: Scawen :thumb: as usual. But I dont know if its good learn people crash car without paying and reset in front of other car.. If someone dont know how to stay on tarmac, he should stay in single player and not going online and ruining races.

[ShannonN]

Something I've coded already but excluded from the recent test patches, because it's incompatible...

In the next incompatible version there will be two options :

- no resets allowed
- resets allowed

No resets will be the default option. Resets will get you out of the dirt and fix your car like in single player. Resets will be regarded as an "arcade" feature, more for first timers who don't yet know how to stay on the track (for example : in an arcade).

I'm wondering about the jump starts as well, if maybe the current start system should be lumped together with "resets allowed" into a single option known as "arcade mode".

If it was like that then Arcade Mode would be like the current LFS but with damage repair on reset plus removal from the gravel traps. Default Mode would disallow resets and allow jump starts.

But maybe those should be two different options - no big deal anyway, just thought I'd mention it, seeing this conversation about resets. It's not very realistic. :D
Sounds like a well thought out plan, however on the topic of resets etc, Please tell me you are going to do something about the AI resetting (from roof etc) and spawning in front of cars that are racing full speed? I tend to play more offline than on and like competent AI, can you please make the AI that get bogged, hide in corners and just sit there respawn in pits if they are stuck for more than 15 seconds? At many tracks the AI just sit in the sand and grind away for 20 laps bogged , and if too many go off there's no one to race against

Can we have them respawn to pits only and go through the pit stop cycle and rejoin from pit lane, also please tell me we will soon have decent AI that will pit for fuel, heed tyre temps and I can train overnight!!! I miss highly trained AI :)

[Gunn]

@Scawen: making these seperate options might be a good way to go. Apart from offering more variety, having these as seperate options might help racers to migrate from arcade to a more serious mode of online play.

[Hankstar]

+1 Scawen
Different modes is a great idea :up:

[flyby3d]

Something I've coded already but excluded from the recent test patches, because it's incompatible...

In the next incompatible version there will be two options :

- no resets allowed
- resets allowed

No resets will be the default option. Resets will get you out of the dirt and fix your car like in single player. Resets will be regarded as an "arcade" feature, more for first timers who don't yet know how to stay on the track (for example : in an arcade).

I'm wondering about the jump starts as well, if maybe the current start system should be lumped together with "resets allowed" into a single option known as "arcade mode".

If it was like that then Arcade Mode would be like the current LFS but with damage repair on reset plus removal from the gravel traps. Default Mode would disallow resets and allow jump starts.

But maybe those should be two different options - no big deal anyway, just thought I'd mention it, seeing this conversation about resets. It's not very realistic. :D

I hope that the "no reset" option includes a "no shift+s" (autopit from everywhere) option :thumb:

[Dumpy]

Boy do I feel dumb. I know I've seen a key assignment for 'reset car' in the options, and I think I may have pressed it a time or two while racing and thought, "Uh, that doesn't do anything?" and forgot about it. Whenever I get unrecoverably stuck in the sand, or end up on my roof, I warp to the pits.

From reading this thread though, I think I favor the option of disabling resets - if you're in a position requiring a reset, it should be "game over man, game over." However, I also like the idea of having a reset delay; this should be significant though. A tow truck can't get to your location, hook you up, pull you out, and unhook in 10 seconds; you should have to wait a minute or more to rejoin the race.

Of course, the delay should be a configurable option as well; when I'm hotlapping online on my hidden private server, I'd rather take the easy way out. I guess I'll have to try this fancy-schmancy "reset" thingy though, if I ever wreck again (lol ;) )

[Chaos]

just a little insight from how it is done IRL> (I work at a race track, have the Clerk of the Course FIA license and our national sporting steward license)

The general FIA rules don't say anything on this. It's always in the rules of the specific league/cup/etc. wheter they allow help from the track marshalls and to what extent. Most common is this: If the car gets stuck somewhere (anywhere) and is able to continue on its own after it has been unstuck (pushed outside the gravel bed, engine started with the internal starter, push start by the track marshalls is forbidden) then everything is fine, no penalties or whatsoever.

Should the car be on its roof and the track marshalls turned the car back on its wheels he could continue (however every car that i've seen that ended on its roof, was undriveable).

So my point of view on this> NO - to the reset&repair option, repairs should only be done in the pits (imagine T1 crashes, where noone has the fear of damaging his car). I say it would be best to allow the reset button, but only when there are no cars around (its safe for the track marshals to help the car out of the gravel / put it back on wheels) and leave the on/off option only for allowing shift+s warp to pits.

[sgt.flippy]

I read some BelCar rules yesterday, and like the guy above said, if you can still start the car, you are allowed to continue, if you can't keep up to the pace, you're allowed to drive 3 laps on that pace. Nobody is allowed to touch the car, so I don't think it's allowed to roll a car back over and it could continue. If a car can't reach the pits on it's own (rolling or driving, no help allowed from marshals or anyone else), it is automatically a forfait. If the driver gets out of the car and gets more than 20 meters away from it, he forfaits too.

It was an interesting read, how these things are set in real life. In lfs I think it should be like in real life, if you're on your roof, you probably won't be able to continue, if you're stuck... You're stuck, nothing to do about it, nobody is allowed to push the car. But it's good to have two differents setups for that, so I'm pro arcade too, I know it's a sim, but hey, you gotta be realistic in a sain thinking way! Not everybody is perfect, and it's not fun to have to sit out an entire race because maybe someone else crashed you.

[Agarash]

.....NO - to the reset&repair option, repairs should only be done in the pits

I do agree with you. NO reset and _repair_ please! Just leave the default setting as it is and add an extra option for hardcore races to disallow reseting car.

[mabyenot]

i totally agree with agarash and the different modes - arcade and total sim mode sound like a very good idea :thumb:

[Hallen]

1) Delayed reset. This is an option to have the martials pull you out of the gravel trap, with a delay and ONLY when the track is clear. If you have ever played GPL, there is a reset, but it waits until there are no cars near you before it works.
This method would not fix damage. You have to be able to drive to the pits to get fixed.

2) Quick reset option. This option allows you to reset when the track is clear. Damage is not fixed. You must drive to the pits to get fixed.

3) Arcade reset. This option resets you and fixes your car. The reset will still only work if the track is clear. (default for offline driving)

4) No reset option. No resets are allowed at all. If you can get your car out of the sand and drive it, you can continue.

Option 2 would be good for online racing in most cases, but option 3 would be OK too in some situations.
Option 1 would be the best for league racing in my opinion, but option 4 would be viable too.

[Cue-Ball]

@Scawen: making these seperate options might be a good way to go. Apart from offering more variety, having these as seperate options might help racers to migrate from arcade to a more serious mode of online play.I agree that keeping things separate is the better solution whenever possible. You never know when or why someone will want to enable one option but disable the other.

Scawen - Can you tell us if shift+S is included in the "no reset" option?

PS> It's nice to see you visit this subforum once in a while. :)