Looking at the speedo

[thisnameistaken]

I can't stop looking at it. I've become so obsessed with knowing exactly how fast I'm going that I'm not getting any faster, because I'm so busy looking at the speedo I can't get my line into the corners right.

Should I just quit, cold-turkey, and force myself to judge my speed until I can do it properly, or is there something else you lot do that I don't do that makes this whole slowing the car down lark a bit more straightforward?

[Rotary]

Turn off the speedo display and go cold turkey :)

[Infiniti]

Dont use digital im old school with the clock style and outta my preferable vision i can see where the needle is estimating and i also have a good sense of speed too, "ive got the need the need for speed *claps* OUUH!"

[deggis]

The clock style would be nice but I can't see shit from it when using 1024x768. Numbers are way too small.

[Infiniti]

Oh really? Im on 1153 X 864 32 bit and I can see it fine, but my monitor is close as it can get its touching the base of my momo so i can feel the speed :D and im young and I still have my own eyeballs lol :razz:

[farcar]

I have a problem obsessively looking for my braking markers rather than the corner I'm about to enter. A seriously bad habit and a hard one to break.

I'm in rehab at the moment...

*twitches*

[Takumi_Project.d]

i look at the tacho but pretty much never look at the speedo at all! its funny, generally people ask you "how fast do you take this corner at?" and i have absolutely no idea. i just know what gear i take it at and roughly what the revs sound like at that time!

i look at the shift light as i am changing through gears on a long straight but thats about it :thumb:

[T.K.Jode]

i look at the tacho but pretty much never look at the speedo at all! its funny, generally people ask you "how fast do you take this corner at?" and i have absolutely no idea. i just know what gear i take it at and roughly what the revs sound like at that time!

i look at the shift light as i am changing through gears on a long straight but thats about it :thumb:

Hah, I used to look at the speedo too until I started listening to the engine and being aware of what gear I'm in. Let's your eyes focus on more important things... like that pile up in T1 :P

[colcob]

I have digital speedo and I look at it quite a lot during quali/hotlapping just to make sure I'm taking maximum corner speed, but I dont look at it as much during racing.

It can be a useful way of judging when your tires are going south on you though, as you can tell that you're unable to carry the same corner speed.

[AndroidXP]

I also use the digital speedo, it just takes too long to get any information out of the analog for me. While racing, I normally only check for the shift light, but lately that gets less too. Normally I only check the speedo on certain corners, like T1 on Aston Nat for example.

But on the other hand, I've tried a few "shift+f laps" and I wasn't doing bad at all. So maybe I should try that more often :smileypul

That reminds me that I really want to be able turning certain HUD elements off. Not the all-or-nothing mentality we have right now.

[Chris_Kerry]

I use the digital speedo, and use it for checking speeds through certain corners. I have learn't to keep one eye on my lines and one on my speedo and rev counter. I think it makes sense to do this more often when in qualification or hotlapping. When in a race I do it less often.

I wish I could say it was making me quick though, but I can't! :D

[markredden]

Digital speedo is the way to go - just so you know what speed you're taking through the corners and down the straight-aways. I find it extremely useful, as I know my own terminal speed through a corner, and I can measure whether I'm pushing the car to its limits.

Having digital speedo is also useful when watching others, to compare the exact speed they are taking through the corners. However, it is not always all about speed, you can be slower but with a better line and get a better lap time.

[tailing]

I'm always checking my corner speed with the digital speedo but I've learnt how to do so without it effecting my driving.

[r8response]

i try to not look at the speedo. sorta distracts you. and makes you want to go faster!

and in my case. i usually crash in doing so :D

[Vain]

I don't use the speedo at all. Only ears and gear-counting.
When I change the gearbox I have really no clue wether I was fast in this corner or not. When I got used to it I will only rely on my ears for upshifting and fine-adjusting my speed in corners.
So when someone asks me how fast I was in that corner I can only say "pretty high in third gear" because I don't know the actual speed and the exact revs.
Strange enough I use the cockpit-view. That means I have a speedo, a tacho and various other informations visible, but don't use any of them.
At least, using this technique, I have 100% of my time to look at the track and the other cars.

Vain

[bbman]

I also take a look at the speedo sometimes... but it's more a quick check if I'm at the right speed than really close looking... Just like in the real world: Quick check - speed ok - race on! :nana: :D

[AndyC]

I have the didital speedo on so I can have a quick louck but when i'm racing I know, down 2 gears and i should be at such a rev (by sound). So everything for my is done by sounds.

Andy.

[ButterTyres]

Yep I'm digital too, I can actually *just* see it in my periferal vision, so I dont have to take my eyes off the road.. cos I know what speed im doing... could be this crap resolution though ;)

But yeah like everyone else, its mainly a hotlapping/fast lap thing, mainly when racing you have to watch the mirrors so speedo drops on the priority...

[mrodgers]

I have a problem obsessively looking for my braking markers rather than the corner I'm about to enter. A seriously bad habit and a hard one to break.

I'm in rehab at the moment...

*twitches*
This is exactly what I do. Which surprises me as I ride a motorcycle, so I'm use to the "look where you want to go, not where you are" concept. You can gain so much time by looking through the corners rather than targetting on your braking points, etc.

And since I drive in the front wheels view, I have the virtual guages on which puts them on the sides and I really don't look at them at all. I also have no idea how fast I am in the corners and such. I do race with the F9 view up so I look at my tire temps and dirt indicators alot. Maybe tonight I'll try to make a few laps using shift-F to turn everything off and see what my lap times are. That could be interesting.

[biggie]

Actually I'm kind of depedent on the speedo as well. It really helps me to compensate for not feeling the G-forces during racing/hotlapping. It's quite easy to judge whether you've gone faster or slower than the lap before because a big part of it depends on your minimum apex speed.
I constantly keep watching the speedo to make sure I'm not going too fast or too slow. Watching the speedo, you can easily determine which line is the fastest through a turn since the highest overall speed should be the fastest. You'll be able to tell exactly whether it's better to take a tighter line through a turn (take a curved exit with slightly less throttle application) or take a wider line (with more throttle at an earlier point) to carry more speed onto the straight.
One thing to look for is how rapidly (or slowly) your speed decreases up to the apex and how quickly (or slowly) you're regaining speed after the apex. Minimum apex speed is not everything as you could be approaching a long way up to the corner far too slowly, having ONLY your minimum apex speed in mind. Then again you could be focussing too much on your minimum apex speed on corner exit so that you miss the optimal point of acceleration.
This is what you'd want to balance. Going in as fast as you can, staying fast for as long as you can, keeping the optimum apex speed but not missing the right point of getting back to throttle.
One more thing you need to be aware of is the manner in which your car accelerates after the apex. You could be flooring throttle very early but not getting the best top speed at the straight because you simply didn't take the smoothest line of the least resistance for the tires.
Figuring out the IDEAL line is a very subtle business but just so fun :)

I have a certain method of judging how well I've exited a corner. On most tracks I have chosen some spots (posts, trees, boards, bumps etc.) at which I keep controlling the speedo to tell from the speed how well I've been doing up to this point. This can be really helpful in understanding where you've lost or gained time.

i look at the tacho but pretty much never look at the speedo at all! its funny, generally people ask you "how fast do you take this corner at?" and i have absolutely no idea. i just know what gear i take it at and roughly what the revs sound like at that time!

i look at the shift light as i am changing through gears on a long straight but thats about it :thumb:

This doesn't work for me because I often tweak the gearing in the process of making a setup. Sometimes the revs/torque don't fit a certain corner at all so I sometimes have to apply some major changes to the gearing.
The only reliable constant is the actual speed. Without it, it would be quite difficult to get to the limit. It would still be possible for me to drive without crashing, but the subtle differences in speed (which decide over tenths and WRs ;)) are hardly noticable by only your vision.

Imo, there's one more (if not the most important) factor for being able to push a car to the limit in LFS. It's sound.
You can tell from the amount of tire squealing how hard you're pushing or if you've just locked/spun your wheels. I personally couldn't ever drive without audio feedback from the car. It is really essential for being able to predict what the car is doing (and thus anticipating a necessary countersteer or drop in throttle).

[Chaos]

One more thing you need to be aware of is the manner in which your car accelerates after the apex. You could be flooring throttle very early but not getting the best top speed at the straight because you simply didn't take the smoothest line of the least resistance for the tires.
Figuring out the IDEAL line is a very subtle business but just so fun :)

I have a certain method of judging how well I've exited a corner. On most tracks I have chosen some spots (posts, trees, boards, bumps etc.) at which I keep controlling the speedo to tell from the speed how well I've been doing up to this point. This can be really helpful in understanding where you've lost or gained time.

Imo, there's one more (if not the most important) factor for being able to push a car to the limit in LFS. It's sound.
You can tell from the amount of tire squealing how hard you're pushing or if you've just locked/spun your wheels. I personally couldn't ever drive without audio feedback from the car. It is really essential for being able to predict what the car is doing (and thus anticipating a necessary countersteer or drop in throttle).
I couldn't have said it better. That's exactly how I drive. I have told to many newbie drivers that they have to learn to listen to their car, that the limit is when the tyres squeal, but only a little.

[Gizz]

well im in the middle here :tilt:


when i first started i was glued to the F9 view but i scrubbed that as it was efecting my driving, as for the speedo i check frequently in given corners to make sure im up to speed, i agree completly with the sound of the revs as there a a few things that can efect this and imo its not the most efective way but we are all diferent :)...

as for the sound of the car gripping in corners is also vital, 9x out of 10 you can correct the car if your pushing it to hard just by the audio given off the tires, i only drive the FO8 and the good thing about that car there is big difference in sound when the car is gripping and when its sliding...

BUT!!!

once i have a setup roughly where i want it to be and can drive it well i then turn all sound OFF!, then i do about 20-30 laps depending on the track with no sound, this is simply for car control as there are NO audio aids you HAVE to learn how to feel the car, and its actulay quite suprising how much you can feel, by doing this i can guage exactly whn the bac end is going to give me jip or the front end comes loose under breaking and turning in,..

this coupled with the sounds given off your tires helps me a great deal in pushing it to the max, although saying that im yet to a perfect lap :( :D

[mrodgers]

Wow Gizz, turn the sounds off for practice/learning. Good idea. I'll have to try that one as well along with turning my HUD overlay off (shift-F). Wonder how good the first few laps will be doing this, LOL.

[ButterTyres]

Yep I have to agree Biggie has nailed it.

I do look at the speedo on the way off the brakes before a corner, because usually you know, you need to brake down to x MPH before letting off and going for the apex, I then check my apex speed, then get back on the throttle at the proper point.

I just need to find out how to get fast.... hmmm.. ;)

[Billeh]

I can't stop looking at it. I've become so obsessed with knowing exactly how fast I'm going that I'm not getting any faster, because I'm so busy looking at the speedo I can't get my line into the corners right.

Should I just quit, cold-turkey, and force myself to judge my speed until I can do it properly, or is there something else you lot do that I don't do that makes this whole slowing the car down lark a bit more straightforward?


use yah ears m8 dont worry about the speedo should be able to tell speed by rev noise and gear u r in ;)

[Gizz]

Wow Gizz, turn the sounds off for practice/learning. Good idea. I'll have to try that one as well along with turning my HUD overlay off (shift-F). Wonder how good the first few laps will be doing this, LOL.

hehe first few laps you will bugger the the gear changes up but thats why i dont do it unless i know the set well enough, but its great for learning to keep the car tight in corners and under breaking as you have to rely on the feeling of the car, and i dont even have FF :pillepall hehehe but you would be suprised at what you can feel..

[MadArrow]

Many race cars in real life don't even have speedometers. What ever line gives you the highest engine speed at the end of the following straight is what I had always been told was the fastest. Split time also will tell you a whole lot.

[ajp71]

I use the digital speedo but only ever look at it to guage the difference between setups and different lines.

[LawVS]

I use the digital speedo and sometimes check the rev meter in case for the time to shift. I check the speedo mostly for corner entry and top speeds. I have a habit in referring to track side objects to predict my laptime. For example, in the FOX at Aston National - from the end of the first white canope of the main grandstand to the finish line is about 4.7 seconds. It can be as much as 5.2 depending on the exit speed from the final chicane.

[RudiTurbo]

I'm also driving like biggie and also sometimes remembering some posts, pavement changes, shadows.
I think thx to being stuck on the speedo with My eyes I might loose some of My stability, since I dont drive the right lines all the time, but I dunno, I just cant do without it :)
Once tryed to drive without sectors, speedos on BL Gti in S1, think I did 1.35.5x, pb at the time was 1.32.2 so it's just the matter of how You feel like :)

[cdub]

(Sorry to dig up an old thread, but better than creating a new one)

Is there a way to set the gauges in the middle of the screen, a la Gran Turismo?

I drive with the custom view with only wheels drawn, so I've got this huge blank space in the middle which would be better if filled with dials :).

[shim]

if i can be bothered puttin me headphones on, i dont look much at the speedo/tacho, and if i dun put em on, me eyes are glued to the tacho on the straights..

[spsamsp]

I can't stop looking at it. I've become so obsessed with knowing exactly how fast I'm going that I'm not getting any faster, because I'm so busy looking at the speedo I can't get my line into the corners right.

Should I just quit, cold-turkey, and force myself to judge my speed until I can do it properly, or is there something else you lot do that I don't do that makes this whole slowing the car down lark a bit more straightforward?

Me too... but the worst thing you can do is get rid of it -

1. you will need it for when you pit in during a race, and

2. It's better to know than to wonder!

[K.David]

I'm not good enough to be able to drive fast laps without fully concentrating on my raceline, and so I don't look at my speed (digital), I disabled split time display and shrunk the size of chat messages (had a bad habit of wanting to read all of them which usually got me in the sandbox)
Still several seconds from WRs, but I'd rather choose this than to have no competition at all. :thumb:

[axus]

I used to look at my speedo a lot when I knew Blackwood's every pixel backwards and the GTi's line around it in S1 but those days are over and now I look at the speedo a bit when starting to learn a track and after I know the brakepoints, the rest comes on feel.

[george_tsiros]

I have disabled everything i can disable. wheel, speedo/rev, pedals, maps. I just listen to the engine and tyres and drive drive drive (with this i am NOT implying that you do not "drive" but i want to emphasize that i do not care much about anything else other than the driving.) and look at either the lap time or if the other guy is gaining on me.

[NotAnIllusion]

I keep the standard HUD on most of the time and still look at the speedo too often, probably because I'm not consistent enough all around, ending up at braking zones at different speeds. Besides the speedo gives something to look at on long straights :p

[sinbad]

Interesting thread. Personally, I have the speedo set to analogue and never even glance at it. I switch it to digital only when I need to know my pit-lane speed.

I don't think real drivers rely on G-forces to tell them how fast they are going, and considering how small the differences between a good corner and a bad corner can be, how fast the things are going past the window is no help either. When I drive on a track, I know how well I drove a section mainly by how wide the car wants to run wide on the exit. If I have road to spare then I was too slow, if I run out of road I was too fast. Then it's usually just a case of adjusting the braking point. It's the same in LFS.

[Tweaker]

The only time I will ever look at the speedo is on crucial corner exits that really can affect your overall laptime.

Like for example, FE Gold, and where you just turn right onto the train tracks bridge... there is a certain speed you know is good or bad when exiting there.

There are only a few places I'd usually look at my speed, but I don't look at it often. I know some people cannot seem to look away from it on every corner and every straight. They have too much on their mind I think. Usually a few glimpses of my speed and split times is the only numerical data I worry about --- oh and maybe my postion in the race too :D

You should get used to driving the track without being distracted. If you've ever driven a car fast, you will notice your focus is never at the minor things in your cockpit, it is always ON THE ROAD/TRACK. There is an even higher focus when on a motorcycle (at least for me).

[mrodgers]

There is an even higher focus when on a motorcycle (at least for me).
Sometimes I look down at the speedo on the bike and I'm surprised at what it's reading.

I always talk in the "cockpit/wheels view" threads about where you should be looking, up ahead on the track. On the motorcycle, this is really easy and natural as my rear end is kicked off the seat a little, I'm leaning over a bit (myself on the edge of the seat), and pushing down on the bars focusing up ahead through the corner to the exit. For some reason, in sim racing, I have to think to do this. I have to remind myself not to look at the corner and not to look at the gauges to see where my speed is. But, I end up doing just that, checking my speed turning into the corners, in the corners, exiting the corners, down the straights.... I know I shouldn't be looking at them and focusing up ahead on the track and preach it all the time when threads like this or the "view" threads come up, but it is hard to do. When I focus up ahead on the track and not pay attention to speed, the apex that I am in, or laptimes, the PB's come left and right and all over the place.

[AeoIus]

Why don't you just create a custom view still ín cockpit, but where you can't see the speedo (if this is possible). I would expect that putting the view position more forward would remove it from your sight.

I'm always looking at the speedo too btw, doing the exact same thing. I tried to do it differently, but keep braking too much before corners if I don't watch the speedo. This is because I usually start braking quite early and modulate it to get to the speed I want to start taking the corner with and still have time to hit the apex (which I often miss to be honest :D )

I better start making some of these adjustments myself too and get racing without the speedo :P